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American Airlines 757 Emergency Landing
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Originally posted by Peter Kesternich View PostWe all (especially the media) need to remember that there is not always an actual emergency when someone screams on a plane
So the real question before judging is... Did the pilot declare an emergency?
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AirDisaster.com Forum Member 2004-2008
Originally posted by orangehuggythe most dangerous part of a flight is not the take off or landing anymore, its when a flight crew member goes to the toilet
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Well, after the BBC vido, the questoin of whether the crew actually declared an emergency still remains unanswered. However, I assume that if the captain elects to return to the point of origin after one hour of flight (meaning he retraces his route for another hour) this was NOT an emergency. If it had been, he would/should have put the plane on the ground asap.
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Originally posted by Peter Kesternich View PostI assume that if the captain elects to return to the point of origin after one hour of flight (meaning he retraces his route for another hour) this was NOT an emergency. If it had been, he would/should have put the plane on the ground asap.
--- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
--- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---
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Originally posted by Evan View PostNot necessarily.
--- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
--- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---
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Originally posted by Gabriel View PostAre you talking about a trivial case like the pilot saying to the flight attendant "my daughter works in the emergency room of the local hospital" or the pilot replying to the ATC "no, we are not declaring an emergency" or are you being serious?
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Originally posted by Evan View PostI'm talking about, for instance, an Air France flight from Rio to CDG encountering severe turbulence and declaring Mayday so that nearby traffic will be vigilantly aware that they are changing flight level. They are in no real danger otherwise. I don't consider that an actual emergency; I consider that an urgency at most. But Mayday and Pan are intended to get radio attention before the situation is declared, which is not always an actual emergency requiring an immediate descent. .
http://www.avherald.com/h?article=42380873&opt=0
Yes, there are two different definitions, however the FAA treats both equally. They will clear the airspace, ask for intentions instead of giving clearances, give priority, offer assistance and emergency services (depending on the situation, of course).
I also knew that the semantics between a "real" emergency and just the statement of an emergency would come out. But when a pilot declares itself in emergency (and all "emergency", "mayday" and "pan" worn, but there are others, it is treated as a real one. And one very good reason to declare an emergency is when you cannot or will not honor the clearance, for example the latitude but not only that.
Take the case of a fuel emergency. You were approaching for landing and have your required fuel for a go around and flight to the alternate + 30 minutes hold. Then you receive a call "hold, expect landing clearance in 40 minutes". You have enough fuel for that and land at your intended destination with more than 30 minutes of fuel, but if you had to go around, you would still have enough fuel to fly and land at your alternate but with less than 30 minutes reserve. You explain that to the controller but he says that the airspace is too busy and can accommodate you sooner. Ah, no? I can: "Emergency, low fuel, straight in to 24R". And it's not that you can do it. You ARE REQUIRED to do it as soon as you estimate that the current course of action may have you landing with less than the required final reserve.
The airplane is never in real danger (because the pilot was not going to fly until dry even if cleared to do so). But the pilot exercised his PIC authority to deviate from a clearance in the name of safety, and to do so he has to declare an emergency (well, declaring one will make his life easier later), and the ATC will clear the airspace for him.
While I don't like this pilot's reaction (and ATC could have done better by saying "fly runway heading, expect clearance for 31R in one minute"), see how it works:
On May 4th, 2010, an American Airlines Boeing 767-200 approaching runway 22L at JFK opts to abort its approach due to high crosswind and low fuel which would...
This was an emergency, even an overreacted one, but look all that happened, and the plane was never ever in any danger whatsoever.
--- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
--- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---
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