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Polish President and wife killed in Tu-154 crash

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  • #16
    Originally posted by HalcyonDays View Post
    If it is true that the crew made 3 or 4 approaches in bad weather, what difference does the aircraft type make ? If it is indeed true, you can maybe understand the pressure on a flightcrew to deliver its VIP passengers to an important and (for the Poles) highly resonant event, even if you can't excuse it. What incredible irony that a senior Polish group of people should lose their lives near Katyn.
    As we both know the Tu-154 isn´t a bad aircraft, but now it´s impossible to fly it as VIP
    plane in Poland. I flew it myself on the Warszaw-Moscow leg during summer 2004.
    I think it was on the 4th landingattempt that it crashed, strange co-indence that the Tu-204 crashed recently manner and all onboard survived in Moscow, even though only crew onboard.
    The B767 has a good safety record, most has been involved with evil intent.
    "The real CEO of the 787 project is named Potemkin"

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    • #17
      This is very sad day for me and other Poles
      Tu154M had not so long ago serious modernisation worth 70 million $, but in confrontation with heavy fog and poor systems at russian military airport, something went wrong ;-(
      RIP president and wife, politics, veterans, clerics, commanders, press and crew of that flight ;-(
      I'm shocked and crying, everyone of those people were very good and important to us...

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      • #18
        Just saw this, terrible for me as well as I am Polish.... I remember seeing this Tupelov 154 in 2007 on the ramp. Very sad..
        Flickr |Airliners.Net | Airplane-Pictures.Net | Jetphotos.Net

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        • #19
          Originally posted by MoBL View Post
          This is very sad day for me and other Poles
          Tu154M had not so long ago serious modernisation worth 70 million $, but in confrontation with heavy fog and poor systems at russian military airport, something went wrong ;-(
          RIP president and wife, politics, veterans, clerics, commanders, press and crew of that flight ;-(
          I'm shocked and crying, everyone of those people were very good and important to us...
          Sounds like a lot for 2 airplanes?
          "The real CEO of the 787 project is named Potemkin"

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          • #20
            So damn terrible... Some serious actions should be taken against this tupolev 154, it took enough lives this year already.

            All of my condolences to the polish people...
            May all who died rest in peace

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            • #21
              Don't blame the aircraft...more likely blame the flight crew for a reverse form of "Get-home-itis".

              They seem to have allowed the need for a Polish governmental presence at a memorial to overcome the safety of their aircraft. Reports say that they were advised by ATC to divert so don't blame the ground services either.

              A terrible tragedy for those on board, their families and the Polish nation. My condolences to all.
              If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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              • #22
                Some additional news

                The BBC news web page states:
                "According to preliminary reports, it got caught up in the tops of trees, fell to the ground and broke up into pieces. There are no survivors in that crash."
                Polish Foreign Ministry spokesman Piotr Paszkowski said it could be assumed with "great certainty" that no-one had survived.
                Polish TV worker Slawomir Wisniewski said he had seen the crash from his hotel near the airport.
                "I saw through the fog, the aeroplane flying very low with the left wing pointing to the ground," he said.
                "I heard something being broken and then that thudding sound. Two flashes of fire next to each other."
                It is unclear how many people were on board. Polish officials said the delegation was 88-strong, while local officials said 96 people had been killed.
                The confusion of the numbers was clarified here on TV. The delegation was 88 strong but in addition there was an 8 member crew on board.
                Fyi, they also found the black boxes as mentioned on Polish television.
                Last edited by Geebee; 2010-04-10, 14:52. Reason: correction of figures

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                • #23
                  According to Russian authorities:
                  - black boxes has been recovered and being analyzed
                  - it was a second approach
                  - rescue teams were dispatched immediately after the crash but there were no survivors
                  - the plane just before the crash was not only below the descent path but also off the runway axis
                  - the plane is completely destroyed, debris scattered on length of aprox. 1 km
                  - casualties will be transported to Moscow

                  According to media:
                  - anonymous a/c member states that polish crew was ordered to break the approach and head for the reserve airport (Minsk or Moscow) but did not comply
                  - some say that it was the fourth, not the second approach
                  - according to the witnesses, the plane overshot the runway, tried to pull up, but rolled on the left wing which hit the trees.
                  - footage from the crash site (only Poccua24 was allowed onto the crash site) shows that the plane was completely destroyed and fire broke out. The only parts recognizable for me were the tail section with one engine still attached to it, the other engine lying a couple of meters further, a vertical stabilizer and parts of undercarriage. There were no bigger parts of fuselage visible. Parts of the footage can be seen:
                  Новости дня от Вести.Ru, интервью, репортажи, фото и видео, новости Москвы и регионов России, новости экономики, погода

                  - body of the president was found and identified
                  - there are 97 confirmed casualties right now, but the Russians stated that there could be as many as 132 of them
                  - the casualties list can be found here


                  R.I.P for all the victims. Condolences for their families and friends.

                  Update:
                  Photos from the crash site:
                  Wiadomości - serwis newsowy portalu Gazeta.pl. Na bieżąco aktualizowane informacje z polityki, wydarzeń w kraju i zagranicą, sportu, gospodarki, kultury i nauki oraz artykuły z prasy polskiej i zagranicznej. Znajdziesz tu teksty, wideo, zdjęcia, sondaże.


                  --
                  Greetz.
                  Zathras

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by TUNISAIR745 View Post
                    .... it took enough lives this year already.
                    When was/were the previous incident(s) this year ?

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Alessandro View Post
                      As we both know the Tu-154 isn´t a bad aircraft, but now it´s impossible to fly it as VIP
                      plane in Poland.
                      Why do you think this ?

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        a bird flew by a cloud is sailing
                        a leaf is falling mallow sprouting
                        and there's silence on high
                        and the Smolensk forest is steaming fog

                        Zbigniew Herbert „Buttons”


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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by ATFS_Crash
                          Unfortunate tragedy. Condolences.

                          Allegedly in fog; four blown approaches then a crash? Didn’t the aircraft and the airport have an ILS system? I don’t understand how a crash like this is very likely with modern equipment. With ILS you should be able to land in virtually blind conditions.
                          AFAIK the airport near Smolensk, where the accident took place, is a small military airport and is not equipped with ILS. I suppose it's just because it's tactically insignificant (only one runway 1600 m long).
                          Besides I'm not sure whether the Tu 154 was equipped to use ILS either...

                          One more curious fact: a military transport that was originally due to land just before the polish plane has been rerouted to it's reserve airport due to weather.

                          --
                          Greetz.
                          Zathras

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                          • #28
                            I'm curious, on a presidential plane, as to who makes the decision to reject and divert in restrictive weather. If it is the PIC, that is a tremendous amount of state responsibility being placed on the judgment of one individual.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Evan View Post
                              I'm curious, on a presidential plane, as to who makes the decision to reject and divert in restrictive weather. If it is the PIC, that is a tremendous amount of state responsibility being placed on the judgment of one individual.
                              I certainly hope it's the PIC, you can't run a ship by committee.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by HalcyonDays View Post
                                Why do you think this ?
                                Polish and Russians has their issues as we all know. Most people are not knowledge of aviation anyways, so inherit the B767s is the best option.
                                "The real CEO of the 787 project is named Potemkin"

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