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  • #16
    I loved the bits "Be careful with your wings on the mountains and "Be careful with the roofs of the houses"

    And then...on departure..... a few seconds after takeoff..... "Terrain ahead, PULL UP. Terrain ahead"


    WTF !!
    If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Evan View Post
      And yet, not a single fatal accident on that extended runway. Just goes to show you what happens when pilots HAVE to be on top of their game.
      You think they were within stable approach criteria?

      ...then again, just another beautiful evening, light winds and a really big airport...no reason to CRITICALLY watch the airspeed, approach profile, power, attitude...little bit high, NP, we'll power back for a bit...ho humm, this is boring.

      (Oh yeah, I remember, the thought of hand flying that approach resulted in feelings of fear)
      Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by 3WE View Post
        You think they were within stable approach criteria?
        Actually, yes! The pilots apparently use visual cues for their rate of descent and relative ground speeds and are so practiced at this that they are probably maintaining a very stable, though laterally contorted, profile. One one video the pilot was using autothrottle but flying manually. I'm guessing its not speed-on-elevator.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Evan View Post
          Actually, yes!
          Based on the first post in this thread, I believe that Lefty disagrees.
          Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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          • #20
            I think Evan might be referring to the last video link involving Druk Air.
            If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by brianw999 View Post
              I think Evan might be referring to the last video link involving Druk Air.
              Could be...

              Evan- where I quoted you (and enjoyed your point) you were right after Brian describing how the wind patterns are brutal at this obscure airport shown in the original post.

              Paraphrased: "All that turbulence and shear and there's never been a crash...amazing what pilots can do when they try..."

              ...and certainly a contrast to Sum Ting Wong and Hui Theiu Lo on their nice long straight, evening approach in beautiful weather to a long-ass runway...where...hey, maybe a human being might let his attention wander from the ASI since it's SOOOOOO mundane...

              Nothing like an interesting contrast and some ironing.

              I sort of jumped over the posts of an even more obscure airport that requires some spectacular and careful (albeit smooth-looking) maneuvering.
              Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by 3WE View Post
                Based on the first post in this thread, I believe that Lefty disagrees.
                I can bet that within such tight constraints the Druk Air guys would probably wave off if they lost 150ft in a half second. Or they would end up in a hillside.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by 3WE View Post
                  Could be...

                  Evan- where I quoted you (and enjoyed your point) you were right after Brian describing how the wind patterns are brutal at this obscure airport shown in the original post.

                  Paraphrased: "All that turbulence and shear and there's never been a crash...amazing what pilots can do when they try..."

                  ...and certainly a contrast to Sum Ting Wong and Hui Theiu Lo on their nice long straight, evening approach in beautiful weather to a long-ass runway...where...hey, maybe a human being might let his attention wander from the ASI since it's SOOOOOO mundane...

                  Nothing like an interesting contrast and some ironing.

                  I sort of jumped over the posts of an even more obscure airport that requires some spectacular and careful (albeit smooth-looking) maneuvering.
                  Yeah, yeah, it's always safer when the pilots are focused on flying. But there are two ends to every cycle. It would not surprise me to learn that a zen Druk pilot messed up a nice VNAV glidepath on the Singapore side.

                  Take Ho Lee Fuk, train him to fly the approach to Paro until he has it down to a science and he will never crash into a mountain in Bhutan. But then put him back in the 777 to SFO and there is no reason to think he is a safer pilot for having mastered that skill. He still hasn't been trained properly on the piloting skills needed to bring a 777 down safely on automation and AT SFO... what modes... how they interact... CRM... stable criteria... where THAT IS THE JOB and those are the skills needed.

                  If you have to be hands-on flying a difficult final to focus on the airspeed or the FMA you are not a 21st-century pilot. Putting Mr. Fuk into the left seat of a 777 was as dangerous as putting him in the approach to Paro and not knowing the flight path. No instincts. No discipline.

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                  • #24
                    3WE,
                    Don't you think that the constant, arrogant use of the word "obscure" has been rather done to death now ? You made your point, please back off. There's a BIG difference between making a point and continually rubbing someone's nose in it.

                    Neither airport that we are talking about can be regarded as "obscure". They are very well known in the world of aviation enthusiasts.

                    You can sit back now with that warm, fluffy feeling that you managed to get under my skin. From now on though I will have to consider editing your posts if you continue with this childish attitude.
                    If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by brianw999 View Post
                      3WE,
                      Don't you think that the constant, arrogant use of the word "obscure" has been rather done to death now ? You made your point, please back off. There's a BIG difference between making a point and continually rubbing someone's nose in it.

                      Neither airport that we are talking about can be regarded as "obscure". They are very well known in the world of aviation enthusiasts.

                      You can sit back now with that warm, fluffy feeling that you managed to get under my skin. From now on though I will have to consider editing your posts if you continue with this childish attitude.
                      Hmmm.....

                      1. I wouldn't be so darn much fun if it didn't get under your skin. Think about that one and maybe your fire tetrahedron on how there's more than one way to stop feeding the fire...

                      2. Yeah, I recall the thread- but what I recall is ~THREE people not knowing of Morgan and Baxter...Stop taking it so personal.

                      3. Ever hear of the phrase "you gotta be able to take it and you gotta be able to dish it out?"
                      3A. Ask Gabriel. I've said some stupid ship and been flamed for it more than once. And you have to have seen my other nickname that starts with 3 and follows with two capital letters?
                      3B. I've seen you dish out crap reasonably well.
                      3C. So why the double standard?

                      4. Know what's funny...those three "aviation enthusiasts" didn't know about the "obscure" writers "that every aviation enthusiast should know about", because they weren't from the US...

                      ...Well, this USA resident had never heard of those airports until yesterday so:

                      4A- Can you see the irony that this "aviation enthusiast" didn't know about a couple of "obscure" airports "that every aviation enthusiast should know about"?.
                      4B- They are, in fact, obscure from my vantage point- just like Flying may be obscure from a non US vantage point.

                      So, wow, isn't 3BS uninformed and isn't the joke on me and isn't it actually a funny little turn around/poetic justice on this whole funny little thing?

                      Perhaps a reader or two discovered some of Len Morgans great writings. I certainly enjoyed discovering two interesting airports.

                      Try to maintain a sense of humor- it's needed.
                      Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        My goodness.....I do believe I may have got under HIS skin for a change.
                        If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Oh and another thing 3WE, you're not ITS, you can drop the bold.

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                          • #28
                            Len Morgan and Gordon Baxter have been gone or retired for how long? Even I'd say they have faded into obscurity sadly. Big shoes to fill and Les Abend is a good read but ...
                            Live, from a grassy knoll somewhere near you.

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