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  • #16
    Originally posted by Evan View Post
    Well, unless it was stalling at the time, I'm guessing it wasn't a large transport category aircraft. The FARS are as follows:

    25.631 The aeroplane (all structure, including windshield) must be designed to assure capability of continued safe flight and landing of the aeroplane after impact with a 4 lb bird when the velocity of the aeroplane (relative to the bird along the aeroplane’s flight path) is equal to Vc at sea-level or 0·85 Vc at 2438 m (8000 ft), whichever is the more critical.

    Vc being design cruise speed.

    The majority of consumer drones are 4lbs or less.
    Of course you know that the mass of the projectile is only one factor in the potential damage. It is not the same a 4lb duvet pillow than a 4lb hardened-and-tempered, 52100-high-carbon-chromium-nickel-molybdenum steel-alloy bearing ball.

    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
    --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Evan View Post
      Well, unless it was stalling at the time, I'm guessing it wasn't a large transport category aircraft. The FARS are as follows:

      25.631 The aeroplane (all structure, including windshield) must be designed to assure capability of continued safe flight and landing of the aeroplane after impact with a 4 lb bird when the velocity of the aeroplane (relative to the bird along the aeroplane’s flight path) is equal to Vc at sea-level or 0·85 Vc at 2438 m (8000 ft), whichever is the more critical.

      Vc being design cruise speed.

      The majority of consumer drones are 4lbs or less.
      ....and birds are made of soft, pliant materials such as feathers and muscle tissue with a light bone structure which after all is part of how they get to fly.
      Drones are made of hard metal and plastic and have solid parts to power their not insubstantial weight off of terra firma and into the air.

      I once experienced a combined impact of around 100 mph with a large cock pheasant ( about 5lbs) that hit the windscreen of my ambulance. It crazed the screen but didn't penetrate it. All we found of the pheasant was its beak.
      A few years ago a colleague was driving at around 60 mph down a motorway and collided with a half house brick (about 3lbs) that was dropped from an overpass bridge by some scumbag. It penetrated the screen and killed his crewmate. The brick had a few bits knocked off of it but was essentially in one piece post impact.
      If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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      • #18
        I can´t believe it. I am not famous for my succinctness.

        For the first time, I said essentially the same than Brian in a tiny fraction of the space he used.

        --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
        --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

        Comment


        • #19

          But my version was more understandable and I gave an example.

          ...and I didn't see your post Gabriel as I was half asleep when I posted !
          If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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          • #20
            so the other thing to consider is this: forget abut human life for a second. are the "rights" of idiots who ant to fly drones into the flight paths of commercial aircraft more important than the rights of airlines who spend hundreds of millions of dollars on aircraft? how much does a "cheap" jet engine cost these days, $30,000,000++?

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            • #21
              You're all familiar with the chicken gun? Maybe we need a drone gun as well.

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              • #22
                Just make sure you defrost the drone !!
                If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Evan View Post
                  You're all familiar with the chicken gun? Maybe we need a drone gun as well.
                  Or how about a gun drone? http://abcnews.go.com/US/gun-firing-drone-subject-federal-investigation/story?id=32585072
                  Be alert! America needs more lerts.

                  Eric Law

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by TeeVee View Post
                    so the other thing to consider is this: forget abut human life for a second. are the "rights" of idiots who ant to fly drones into the flight paths of commercial aircraft more important than the rights of airlines who spend hundreds of millions of dollars on aircraft? how much does a "cheap" jet engine cost these days, $30,000,000++?
                    I think that all we agree that this issue is a very big concern from many points of views (economic, safety, legal, etc...).

                    We are just putting the things in context and comparing with other already known risks.

                    --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                    --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Observer View Post
                      There are news on this case:

                      Police immediately responded and dispatched a helicopter as well as ground forces to search for the operator of the drone, but was unsuccessful at first in locating the drone or its operator. Continued investigation was able to identify the operator however, a 39 year old resident of Piaseczno, located underneath the approach path runway 33 spanning from about 3 to 6.5nm from the threshold runway 33. The 39 year old is being questioned by police, admitted to have flown his drone in the area on Jul 20th and faces charges of endangering aviation safety that could imprison him for up to 8 years.
                      Finally they caught one!!! (no word yet on the type of drone or its size or weight)

                      --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                      --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        There are camera carrying drones that weigh over 2 kg without the camera. A Go Pro camera adds around 400 gm.
                        If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
                          I can´t believe it. I am not famous for my succinctness.

                          For the first time, I said essentially the same than Brian in a tiny fraction of the space he used.
                          Watch the movie, "Meet the Fokkers". It's not about airplanes, but discusses "The Circle of Trust"

                          You are not in the Circle of Trust, Gabriel, and it will be a long time before you will be (if ever)
                          Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by TeeVee View Post
                            so the other thing to consider is this: forget abut human life for a second. are the "rights" of idiots who ant to fly drones into the flight paths of commercial aircraft more important than the rights of airlines who spend hundreds of millions of dollars on aircraft? how much does a "cheap" jet engine cost these days, $30,000,000++?
                            I always find it interesting when folks discuss the rights of drivers at sobriety checkpoints and how the fifth amendment balances with the police's rights to check for obvious indications of intoxication.

                            Of course, my comment is invalid because cars are super cheap compared to jet engines. In this case, it's human lives we worry about (and the body count is much much bigger than the drone body count.)

                            I understand, that if you have been drinking, you only crack the window, tell the officer that you do not have to answer any questions, ask them "am I being detained" and "on what grounds" and "may I leave now".

                            Then officer's only hopes are:
                            1) To catch of whif of air (passive Breathalyzer which may also be of limited legal value).
                            2) That you display very clear signs of intoxication (slurred speech, bad driving).
                            3) Lie and/or make an illegal search in violation of your fifth amendment rights.
                            (This may vary slightly from state to state, but is based on the general principle's of the US Constitution)

                            It's an interesting legal tension between freedom and the need to regulate idiots- which me make a big deal of in the Union of Socialist States of America, comrade.
                            Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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                            • #29
                              By the way, no one is disputing that a drone (whether 500 grams or 2 kg) might destroy a jet engine (or at least send it to the scrap heap for safety reasons) and indeed this does create a genuine increased risk.

                              But the question is if it's a normal font, calm discussion or ALL CAPS BOLD TOTAL AIR DISASTER BAN ALL ARPLANES!!!!! type of issue.

                              I kind of think it's regular font and lots of gray area issues.
                              Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by 3WE View Post
                                Watch the movie, "Meet the Fokkers". It's not about airplanes, but discusses "The Circle of Trust"

                                You are not in the Circle of Trust, Gabriel, and it will be a long time before you will be (if ever)
                                Would you care to explain what that means ?
                                If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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