UPS Cargo Jet Crashes Near Birmingham Shuttlesworth International Airport

[3WE]

But anyway, what's your point?

The inability to understand that leveling off at an intended altitude and location is generally not a dangerous process.

[Evan]

But anyway, what's your point?

Just taking a stab at what mode they might have been using. I figured a steady airspeed might indicate LVL/CH but I guess not. Also, Airbus recommends V/S for descent of 2000' or less and LVL/CH for descent greater than 2000'.


Regarding four oh' oneing: the A306 does have that CWS autopilot function...

[Gabriel]

Just taking a stab at what mode they might have been using. I figured a steady airspeed might indicate LVL/CH but I guess not.

I bet a Quilmes Cristal that this plane crashed with the AT properly engaded and correctly holding the desired speed and the AP properly engaged in VS mode and correctly holding the selected VS.

Also, Airbus recommends [...] LVL/CH for descent greater than 2000'.

Even if it's the final approach?

Regarding four oh' oneing: the A306 does have that CWS autopilot function...

And? The "Dude! Give me a Diet Pepsi and let's four one oh' it" case was not CWS but VS + ALT HLD.

[Evan]

I bet a Quilmes Cristal that this plane crashed with the AT properly engaded and correctly holding the desired speed and the AP properly engaged in VS mode and correctly holding the selected VS.

And correctly descending to the selected altitude? It's been a while since I've had a Quilmes but I still wouldn't take that bet.

And? The "Dude! Give me a Diet Pepsi and let's four one oh' it" case was not CWS but VS + ALT HLD.

Ok, I'm confused. What case was that? I thought you were referring to Eastern 401.

[Gabriel]

And correctly descending to the selected altitude?

I meant that they were working with the AP in VS and the AP was doing well it's job of doing whatever the pilots entered, including intersecting the flightpath and the terrain.

It's been a while since I've had a Quilmes but I still wouldn't take that bet.

What? Didn't you like it? I don't drink beer, but beyond it being the favorite beer here, most foreigners seem to like it.

Ok, I'm confused. What case was that? I thought you were referring to Eastern 401.

Pinnacle CRJ. It was "for one oh'" meaning FL 410. Not "for oh one".

[Evan]

What? Didn't you like it? I don't drink beer, but beyond it being the favorite beer here, most foreigners seem to like it.

No, I'd love the Quilmes. I meant I wouldn't bet against your VS theory.

Pinnacle CRJ. It was "for one oh'" meaning FL 410. Not "for oh one".

I guess I botched that readback. Good thing I'm not a pilot.

[Gabriel]

I guess I botched that readback. Good thing I'm not a pilot.

No, it was my mistake. I had said for oh' one.

[EconomyClass]

Just read this: http://www.alpa.org/portals/alpa/pre...-10-14_PCL.pdf

So many vulnerabilities in plane design. Reminds me of the 737 episodes where supercooling caused the tail surface to do the opposite of the pilot input. And it took several gorounds before the right research finally figured out something the design engineers didn't know possible.

[Gabriel]

Just read this: http://www.alpa.org/portals/alpa/pre...-10-14_PCL.pdf

So many vulnerabilities in plane design.

What
Are
You
Talking
About
?????

[BoeingBobby]

So many vulnerabilities in plane design. Reminds me of the 737 episodes where supercooling caused the tail surface to do the opposite of the pilot input. And it took several gorounds before the right research finally figured out something the design engineers didn't know possible.

Your kidding me right?

[Leftseat86]

Just read this: http://www.alpa.org/portals/alpa/pre...-10-14_PCL.pdf

So many vulnerabilities in plane design. Reminds me of the 737 episodes where supercooling caused the tail surface to do the opposite of the pilot input. And it took several gorounds before the right research finally figured out something the design engineers didn't know possible.

The only vulnerability in this case was that of complete imbeciles flying the airplane wrong.

[Leftseat86]

Just read this: http://www.alpa.org/portals/alpa/pre...-10-14_PCL.pdf

I can't believe the lengths they're going here to defend these idiots.

[Highkeas]

.............
........... the 737 episodes where supercooling caused the tail surface to do the opposite of the pilot input. ................

Could you (or anyone) provide a source for this info.
I find it strange since supercooling has been known about for a long time and aircraft mechanisms (at least where I have worked) are tested under iced conditions. As I find out how incidents happen I include appropriate requirements in specifications or bring them up during reviews.

[Evan]

"That's funny. It got up here but it won't stay up here."

Actual words out of a federally certified transport pilot's mouth...

[Evan]

What
Are
You
Talking
About
?????

He's talking about core-lock, a previously little-known phenomena that can occur when a couple of out-of-work rodeo clowns get a job flying turbofan airplanes without seeming to know the first thing about them.