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Malaysia Airlines Loses Contact With 777 en Route to Beijing

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  • This is interesting



    AirDisaster.com Forum Member 2004-2008

    Originally posted by orangehuggy
    the most dangerous part of a flight is not the take off or landing anymore, its when a flight crew member goes to the toilet

    Comment


    • There were a lot of things at play in the KAL scenario, it was a different era when it came to politics and slight deviations were part of "the game".
      Live, from a grassy knoll somewhere near you.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by guamainiac View Post
        There were a lot of things at play in the KAL scenario, it was a different era when it came to politics and slight deviations were part of "the game".
        The "Cold War Era" is not over. They just replaced the name, it is now the "Wolfowitz Doctrine".
        A Former Airdisaster.Com Forum (senior member)....

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        • Potentially interesting. Although either broken or overloaded as have been unable to persuade it to load a single map tile...

          Comment


          • Originally posted by sjwk View Post
            Potentially interesting. Although either broken or overloaded as have been unable to persuade it to load a single map tile...
            Ditto.

            Google launched a similar campaign with Google Maps when a famous US aviator (forgot his name) went missing, uploading post-crash high resolution photos of the search area. It yielded no results and the plane remained missing for several months until an outdoorsman found an ID of that person (maybe the driving licence). New searches in the area located the wreckage, that was so destroyed that would have been almost impossible to associate with a crashed airplane in an aerial photo.

            --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
            --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

            Comment


            • Originally posted by retox View Post
              Malaysian Air has confirmed "the plane has ACARS" with typical 1 minute collection at 29,000 ft limit.
              Source please.

              That makes no sense. First of all, ACARS reporting is event based so what this likely means is that it collects and delays until the next minute IF there is an event to report. Secondly, it is designed to report events at cruise altitude so why would it have a 29,000 ft ceiling?

              ACARS would not help locate the a/c unless an event had been reported in the vicinity of the crash site. If the a/c was in a steep, rapid descent we would see ADVISORY CABIN VERTICAL SPEED due to the pressure differential, as we did with AF447. I recall discussions suggesting that if the a/c was in an unusual atittude the SATCOM antenna might be unable to transmit.

              I think downlink information is being withheld here to suppress damaging speculation in the press.

              Comment


              • We, and everybody else, have been distracted by many red herrings and been up a few cul de sacs. So let's look again from the current position.

                It is increasingly unlikely that the aircraft went down at or near the point of last or lost contact (there is a difference between the two). Otherwise we would have expected impact evidence by now.

                This is where, until now, its logical to have concentrated search resources.

                The only other scenario is that the plane went 'dark' deliberately or accidentally and flew to another point before coming down one way or another. This must now be upper in the minds of the authorities. Where and why being the two questions.

                We can assume by now they will have run psychological profiles on all known on board and particularly the crew. This may have led to some informed hypotheses. However they are just that and there may be more than one.

                They would be sillier than us speculating here by declaring those hypotheses openly but its difficult to hide recovery planes and ships so we are getting these apparently bizarre and mutually contradictory shifts in the search.

                I just hope it didn't go somewhere it shouldn't and some scared military type did something silly. The political fallout between the major actors involved would be even more serious than the loss of aircraft and people. alternatively they need time to sort and agree to a cover story to save face and possibly peace. But there I go speculating again.

                Whereas the best fit to the situation as we know it is one or more of the crew did take it out of contact and somewhere else for an unknown purpose or under unknown pressure and it didn't end happily.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by sjwk View Post
                  Potentially interesting. Although either broken or overloaded as have been unable to persuade it to load a single map tile...
                  I've already found a bunch of items (15-20) all within 600 yards of each other. Probably rubbish.
                  AirDisaster.com Forum Member 2004-2008

                  Originally posted by orangehuggy
                  the most dangerous part of a flight is not the take off or landing anymore, its when a flight crew member goes to the toilet

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Evan View Post
                    Source please.

                    That makes no sense. First of all, ACARS reporting is event based so what this likely means is that it collects and delays until the next minute IF there is an event to report. Secondly, it is designed to report events at cruise altitude so why would it have a 29,000 ft ceiling?

                    ACARS would not help locate the a/c unless an event had been reported in the vicinity of the crash site. If the a/c was in a steep, rapid descent we would see ADVISORY CABIN VERTICAL SPEED due to the pressure differential, as we did with AF447. I recall discussions suggesting that if the a/c was in an unusual atittude the SATCOM antenna might be unable to transmit.

                    I think downlink information is being withheld here to suppress damaging speculation in the press.
                    It reports events in 1 min intervals and is guaranteed reliable ABOVE 29,000 ft (not below).

                    There are several scenarios that would result in no ACARS data - just let your mind run wild. Ultimately though, you still can't draw up any thesis here that is not a wild ass guess. The information so far has been unreliable, contradictory, and speculative.

                    All we know for sure is a plane is missing (well, probably). Might as well throw in the idea that there was a pallet of currency or crate of gold and this thing was stolen.

                    Comment


                    • The two men said by Interpol to have been travelling on stolen passports on the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 that mysteriously disappeared on Saturday have been identified as Iranian nationals.

                      A BBC Persia report quotes an Iranian friend of one of the men, who said he hosted the pair in Kuala Lumpur after they arrived from Tehran in the days preceding their flight to Beijing.

                      The friend, who knew one of the men from his school days in Iran, said the men had bought the fake passports because they wanted to migrate to Europe.

                      The pair were travelling on passports belonging to Christian Kozel, an 30-year-old Austrian, and Luigi Maraldi, a 37-year-old Italian.
                      They had bought the passports in Kuala Lumpur as well as tickets to Amsterdam, via Beijing.

                      One of the Iranian national's intended final destination was Frankfurt, where his mother lives, while the other wanted to travel to Denmark.

                      The same source that spoke to BBC Persia also emailed CNN with a photograph of him posing with his two friends in the days before they embarked on their fateful trip.

                      BBC Persia’s UN correspondent Bahman Kalbasi told The Telegraph that the two Iranians were “looking for a place to settle”.

                      Both Malaysia and neighbouring Thailand, where the passports were originally stolen, host large and established Iranian communities.

                      US-led sanctions on Iran have plagued the economy and encouraged many young Iranians, who face high unemployment, to seek ways to travel to Europe, North America or Australia – legally or illegally.

                      Investigators in Malaysia are also voicing scepticism that the airliner that disappeared early Saturday with 239 people on board was the target of an attack, US and European government sources close to the probe said.

                      Neither Malaysia's Special Branch, the agency leading the investigation locally, nor spy agencies in the United States and Europe have ruled out the possibility that militants may have been involved in downing Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370.

                      But Malaysian authorities have indicated that the evidence so far does not strongly back an attack as a cause for the aircraft's disappearance, and that mechanical or pilot problems could have led to the apparent crash, the US sources said.

                      "There is no evidence to suggest an act of terror," said a European security source, who added that there was also "no explanation what's happened to it or where it is."

                      Meanwhile, dozens of ships and aircraft from 10 countries were still scouring the seas around Malaysia and south of Vietnam as questions mounted over possible security lapses that could have led to a downing of the Boeing 777-200ER after it climbed to an altitude of 10,670 metres.

                      Interpol confirmed on Sunday at least two passengers used stolen passports and said it was checking whether others aboard had used false identity documents.

                      Even so, one US source said Malaysian authorities were leaning away from the theory that the plane was attacked. Their view was mostly based on electronic evidence that indicates the flight may have turned back toward the Malaysian capital of Kuala Lumpur before disappearing.
                      The two men said by Interpol to have been travelling on stolen passports on the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 that mysteriously disappeared on Saturday have been identified as Iranian nationals.


                      This of course doesn't mean that "the friend" is telling the truth, or that he was told the truth by his friends (if the story as a whole is true to begin with).

                      --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                      --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                      Comment


                      • Surprised no one has tried what the French did with Air France 447, send in some attack submarines to listen for the locator beacons on the data recorders. Granted it didn't work, but it was still an interesting idea.

                        I always wanted to start a long, interesting thread on the site. I just hate that it had to be about something like this.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by B757300 View Post
                          Surprised no one has tried what the French did with Air France 447, send in some attack submarines to listen for the locator beacons on the data recorders. Granted it didn't work, but it was still an interesting idea.

                          I always wanted to start a long, interesting thread on the site. I just hate that it had to be about something like this.
                          Were talking about 200-250ft depths here. Or less. It's not there. It's somewhere else.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
                            http://www.smh.com.au/world/missing-...#ixzz2vbwqfhfp

                            This of course doesn't mean that "the friend" is telling the truth, or that he was told the truth by his friends (if the story as a whole is true to begin with).
                            It's sounds reasonable though. Perhaps the passport thing is coincidental. I just don't think organized terrorism is going for hardened targets like this (they were nice soft targets on 9/11).

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by retox View Post
                              The suggestion many had here after AF447 was a distress beacon that detaches/ejects from the tail, or wing. The common objection was that this type of accident does not happen enough to warrant the extreme cost. AF447 was eventually found and it's not as if cutting some time off of the search would have saved anyone. People just don't like to wait for news I suppose and it ends up fueling all the silly rumors.
                              First round of silly rumors has arrived:

                              Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.

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                              • The plot thickens

                                Beijing - The mystery surrounding the disappearance of Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 has thickened somewhat as family members of passengers have reported mobile phones ringing, but nobody answering.

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