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  • Our people are our most important asset...

    Never mind retirements and attrition, we have to cut now so that we can push the limits of duty hour regulations and delay and cancel flights when there's scheduling hiccups and cabin crews are not available...

    (Yes, it's my fault, I compare ticket prices on online)

    Originally posted by Reuters
    United Airlines offers flight attendants $100,000 in voluntary buyout

    By Jeffrey Dastin

    NEW YORK, Sept 15 (Reuters) - United Airlines and union officials said Monday that eligible flight attendants will be paid up to $100,000 to leave the company through a voluntary buyout, in a deal that aims to end furloughs at the over-staffed airline.

    The agreement comes six years after United, which employs more than 23,000 stewards, retired a number of its planes, leaving the company 2,000-plus flight attendants above capacity.

    While some 1,450 were still on unpaid leave for the company this month, United said Monday that it now is recalling all of its attendants so they may apply for the separation payment or return to work.

    The Association of Flight Attendants, which represents United's stewards, lauded the high-paying severance as "virtually unprecedented in the airline industry."

    United's cooperation with AFA bodes well for contract negotiations that have been going on since the carrier merged with Continental Airlines in 2010. The relative seniority of each carrier's flight attendants has yet to be determined, and despite a single operating certificate, United and Continental stewards have not yet integrated.

    "Recalling furloughed flight attendants and aligning our staffing to match our flying schedule will further facilitate the company and AFA reaching a joint collective bargaining agreement," said Mike Bonds, United's executive vice president for human resources and labor relations, in a statement. "It's another positive step in what has become a productive relationship with AFA."

    The deal also has the potential to cut United's costs if the carrier replaces senior flight attendants who accept the severance with junior ones hired at a lower pay grade, according to industry consultant George Hamlin.

    Still, Hamlin offered a word of caution.

    "Why did it take so long to get to this?" he said, adding that United and Continental "still have to come up with a way to deploy all (of their) flight attendants as one entity."

    The airline has made separate collective bargaining agreements with its pilots, fleet service and passenger service groups.

    United's stock fell almost 1.7 percent Monday to close at $49.56 per share. The announcement came out after the close of New York trading.

    (Reporting by Jeffrey Dastin; Editing by Cynthia Osterman)
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

  • #2
    Well, it's a good deal for any senior f/a's that were waiting for a reason to stop flying two trips a month and finally leave the company...now they have 100,000 reasons, and all in a lump sum package. Yes, United still needs to cut costs (if for no other reason than that people still do online comparison shopping on ticket prices...), but also because it's cabin crew are still not integrated (something United has limited control over), and that keeps United from using it's crews as fully and efficiently as possible, which ultimately costs the airline more money.

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    • #3
      as if this cost cutting is going to trickle down to passengers...fat friggin chance! AA has allegedly cut costs and heir ticket prices have gone up in a big way since the merger with usair.

      it's all horseshit from a pax perspective. it's about more profits for wall street and shareholders.

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      • #4
        Wow, that's USD 145 million!!!
        If they manage to get more profit and value for the shareholders for that, I'm ok with it. It's called "return on investment" (and a 145M investment is not a small investment).

        --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
        --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

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        • #5
          Originally posted by TeeVee View Post
          as if this cost cutting is going to trickle down to passengers...fat friggin chance! AA has allegedly cut costs and heir ticket prices have gone up in a big way since the merger with usair.

          it's all horseshit from a pax perspective. it's about more profits for wall street and shareholders.
          It will always be about making profits for the shareholders before it will EVER be about a better flying experience for the passengers...that's just how it is for now, at least until someone perfects an easier means of point to point travel that doesn't involve a crowd of people flying around in a metal tube.


          Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
          Wow, that's USD 145 million!!!
          If they manage to get more profit and value for the shareholders for that, I'm ok with it. It's called "return on investment" (and a 145M investment is not a small investment).
          Delta has previously offered buyout packages to it's employees (three since 2008...), and it hasn't been hurting that airline's bottom line one bit. It's a one-time financial hit, but in the long run it saves the airline more money than they spend on the buyouts. They could just do layoffs (furloughs), but they would be furloughing the exact people that they would prefer to keep...the younger, lower paid, more productive workers at the bottom of the seniority ranks. It's the older, higher paid, less productive workers at the top that they want out, and what better (and legal) way to do that than throwing big bags of money at them.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by cegro27 View Post
            ?.......It's the older, higher paid, less productive workers at the top that they want out, and what better (and legal) way to do that than throwing big bags of money at them.
            You missed out one VERY important word there.

            .......EXPERIENCED.....

            I'm retired now but I was one of the highest paid paramedics around with 34 years training and experience. I've been replaced by two much lower qualified, totally inexperienced persons who get paid half what I got paid, take twice as long to do the basic job and then call another higher qualified person or crew out when the shit hits the fan and the patient goes downhill.
            The result ?
            More time taken to treat the patient, more likelihood of the patient deteriorating, more personnel cost per call and less personnel available for other calls.

            But never mind.....the first response got there in 8 minutes so the required government standards were achieved and the bosses can go back to their tea and medals.
            What a load of bollocks !
            If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

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            • #7
              Originally posted by brianw999 View Post
              You missed out one VERY important word there.

              .......EXPERIENCED.....

              I'm retired now but I was one of the highest paid paramedics around with 34 years training and experience. I've been replaced by two much lower qualified, totally inexperienced persons who get paid half what I got paid, take twice as long to do the basic job and then call another higher qualified person or crew out when the shit hits the fan and the patient goes downhill.
              The result ?
              More time taken to treat the patient, more likelihood of the patient deteriorating, more personnel cost per call and less personnel available for other calls.

              But never mind.....the first response got there in 8 minutes so the required government standards were achieved and the bosses can go back to their tea and medals.
              What a load of bollocks !

              While it's true that experience can be a major factor in some professions, the level of experience between being an f/a and being a paramedic are VASTLY different. You should also keep in mind that United is looking for about 2,000 takers for the buyout, out of more than 23,000 f/a's. If the top 2,000 in seniority take the buyout, the "most junior" of that number would have at least 35 years....AT LEAST. That still leaves a substantial number of f/a's (between 15-35 years seniority) with plenty of experience still employed with the airline.

              Also, this a "buyout", not a "furlough"....no one eligible for this package is being forced to take it....and any future furloughing would only affect those at the bottom of the seniority list.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by cegro27 View Post
                While it's true that experience can be a major factor in some professions, the level of experience between being an f/a and being a paramedic are VASTLY different. You should also keep in mind that United is looking for about 2,000 takers for the buyout, out of more than 23,000 f/a's. If the top 2,000 in seniority take the buyout, the "most junior" of that number would have at least 35 years....AT LEAST. That still leaves a substantial number of f/a's (between 15-35 years seniority) with plenty of experience still employed with the airline.

                Also, this a "buyout", not a "furlough"....no one eligible for this package is being forced to take it....and any future furloughing would only affect those at the bottom of the seniority list.
                i think you math is wrong.

                35 years of seniority? i'd love to see the number of f/a's flying for united with 35 years of seniority. i doubt there are very many. and while 35 years sounds like a shitload, i'll bet even their salaries suck.

                and once again, the executives prove to the world why US airlines will never be amongst the best in the world. rather, they fit in somewhere between europe's bargain basement carriers and africa's regionals.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by TeeVee View Post
                  i think you math is wrong.

                  35 years of seniority? i'd love to see the number of f/a's flying for united with 35 years of seniority. i doubt there are very many. and while 35 years sounds like a shitload, i'll bet even their salaries suck.
                  No math needed...I already know they're plenty with that level of seniority...and while salaries may indeed "suck", I promise you they don't "suck" nearly as much as those of the much more junior f/a's.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by TeeVee View Post
                    35 years of seniority? i'd love to see the number of f/a's flying for united with 35 years of seniority. i doubt there are very many. and while 35 years sounds like a shitload, i'll bet even their salaries suck.
                    I think you'll be surprised, and not very pleasantly either.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ATLcrew View Post
                      I think you'll be surprised, and not very pleasantly either.
                      unless AA employs only a small fraction of such "experienced" folks, they must have them in hiding. can't say much about united/continental since i stopped flying them over a decade ago

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by TeeVee View Post
                        unless AA employs only a small fraction of such "experienced" folks, they must have them in hiding. can't say much about united/continental since i stopped flying them over a decade ago
                        Uncontinent certainly has no shortage of such folk, as does Delta. American may have somewhat fewer since many of them were ex-TWA and none to keen to work on the silverbirds.

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