Syria Shoots down Turkish F4 Jet

[tsv]

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1...downs-warplane

Interesting move by Syria to take out a Turkish Fighter. They say that it was unidentified but wouldn't their radar systems have tracked the flight from the moment it left it's Turkish base? The F4 is an old Jet so presumably not very stealthy.

I can't imagine what the point in shooting down the Aircraft would be unless they seriously thought it was going to attack them. Isn't the normal response to Scramble some Fighters and Intercept the Intruder? If so why didn't they just do this?

I also can't imagine what Turkey will do. Syria is already in a virtual state of Civil War so an invasion would seem unlikely. They could bomb the joint but would likely lose more Aircraft in the process and possibly get bombed themselves in retaliation. And softer punishments like Sanctions are pretty much already in place. Perhaps they will give the Syrian Opposition a heap of free Armaments to help them overturn the Government?

[SYDCBRWOD]

Originally Posted by tsv

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1...downs-warplane

Interesting move by Syria to take out a Turkish Fighter. They say that it was unidentified but wouldn't their radar systems have tracked the flight from the moment it left it's Turkish base?

No. The earth is curved, the radar horizon of ground based radar means they may have been able to detect aircraft only at altitude over turkish soil. They would not have been able to detect aircraft taking off unless the airfield was very close to the syrian border and thesyrian radar was too. The exception is if they had a high flying AWACS (but they don't) and the turkish base was fairly close to the syrian border.

Originally Posted by tsv

The F4 is an old Jet so presumably not very stealthy.

Correct. A flying barn door metaphorically speaking. BUT, if you read the report the jet came in low and fast from the sea. Why low? To get under the radar - exactly what a jet on an attack profile might do.

Originally Posted by tsv

I can't imagine what the point in shooting down the Aircraft would be unless they seriously thought it was going to attack them.

Attack profile - flying low and fast - the F4 is one of the Turkish Air Forces Attack airframes. Question for you - you are a Syrian, your country is virtually on a war footing (albeit against your own people!), your country is an international pariah in 90% of the countries around the world and you are confronted by a fast mover on an attack profile. If the aircraft was shot down by AA, it must have been well within the Syrian Air Defence Interception Zone. well within Syrian airspace. You'd probably pull the trigger too.

Originally Posted by tsv

Isn't the normal response to Scramble some Fighters and Intercept the Intruder? If so why didn't they just do this?

If it was flying low and fast, it would only have been detected a few tens of seconds to a minute before it would be over Syrian soil. Unless the Syrian authorities had A Combat Air Patrol over that part of the coast there is no way that they could scramble anything in hopes of intercepting the F4 before it would have been theoretically able to fly to its target, drop its bombs and be on its way back into international airspace.

Originally Posted by tsv

I also can't imagine what Turkey will do. Syria is already in a virtual state of Civil War so an invasion would seem unlikely. They could bomb the joint but would likely lose more Aircraft in the process and possibly get bombed themselves in retaliation. And softer punishments like Sanctions are pretty much already in place. Perhaps they will give the Syrian Opposition a heap of free Armaments to help them overturn the Government?

Guess we wait and see...

[brianw999]

Attack profile - flying low and fast - the F4 is one of the Turkish Air Forces Attack airframes. Question for you - you are a Syrian, your country is virtually on a war footing (albeit against your own people!), your country is an international pariah in 90% of the countries around the world and you are confronted by a fast mover on an attack profile. If the aircraft was shot down by AA, it must have been well within the Syrian Air Defence Interception Zone. well within Syrian airspace. You'd probably pull the trigger too.

Damn right I'd pull the trigger !!

If it was flying low and fast, it would only have been detected a few tens of seconds to a minute before it would be over Syrian soil. Unless the Syrian authorities had A Combat Air Patrol over that part of the coast there is no way that they could scramble anything in hopes of intercepting the F4 before it would have been theoretically able to fly to its target, drop its bombs and be on its way back into international airspace.

Exactly.....and the Syrians wouldn't know the type of aircraft either so.... low and fast....attack profile....no positive ident ?

....it's bang bang time.

Now then, there's no way on my Christian God's earth that I would ever support the current Syrian regime.....but the Turks need their brain bumps feeling for pulling this stupid stroke !

I served in Germany for a short while during the cold war and recall British and American fighters engaging in a high speed, low level, 90 degree angle to the border, attack profile towards the border and peeling off at the last moment to fly parallel just inside the western side of the border.
An officer I spoke to once expressed the comment that ... "One day one of those smartass flyboys are going to fuck up and miss their turning point. I am fairly certain that life will almost immediately get rather interesting, if not a little noisy !!"