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Passenger goes postal in baggage claim with conveniently checked firearm

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  • Passenger goes postal in baggage claim with conveniently checked firearm

    Some tragedies are unforeseeable, or at least the risk factors are steathy. This isn't one of them. Hopefully this will put an end to firearms in checked bags. In an age of terrorism and explosive nutjob growth, where we have to take off our shoes and belts and have our tiny scissors confiscated, WHY IN THE HELL ARE WE ALLOWING PEOPLE TO BRING GUNS INTO AN AIRPORT?!!

    I know... I know... Americans love their toys... and toying with the purpose and intention of the second amendment...

    Anyway, this is what happens. Hopefully the FAA or the TSA will now take the logical path and ban this absurdly overlooked danger.

    Law enforcement officials identified Esteban Santiago, 26, as the suspect in the five deaths at Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport. Authorities revised the number of wounded to six.

  • #2
    Passenger goes postal in baggage claim with firearm checked ACCORDING TO PROCEDURE...

    Fixed.
    Les règles de l'aviation de base découragent de longues périodes de dur tirer vers le haut.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by 3WE View Post
      Fixed.
      Yes, well that is what needs fixing.

      Comment


      • #4
        A declared, unloaded, firearm in a locked case can be in checked baggage. It is no more dangerous than a club. And if he wanted to shoot up an airport, he could have walked into the terminal and opened fire on any non-secure area. If he was determined to cause mass destruction, allowing or prohibiting guns in checked baggage would not have made a difference except perhaps where he decide to attack.

        And right now, there is still no definitive cause as to why the guy started shooting. He might be crazy, might be Islam (based on some of his social media), or may be no logical reason.

        Based on what some of his family is saying, it sounds like it could be the onset of schizophrenia. He is at the right age (most often strikes people in their 20s) and apparently was showing some of the symptoms such as delusions and believing he is being mind controlled.

        Personally, I would not take a gun with me when I fly as I don't trust the airline not to lose it or have it get stolen. Anything of high value goes with me onto the plane and since a gun cannot, it stays home in the safe.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by B757300 View Post
          A declared, unloaded, firearm in a locked case can be in checked baggage. It is no more dangerous than a club. And if he wanted to shoot up an airport, he could have walked into the terminal and opened fire on any non-secure area. If he was determined to cause mass destruction, allowing or prohibiting guns in checked baggage would not have made a difference except perhaps where he decide to attack.

          And right now, there is still no definitive cause as to why the guy started shooting. He might be crazy, might be Islam (based on some of his social media), or may be no logical reason.

          Based on what some of his family is saying, it sounds like it could be the onset of schizophrenia. He is at the right age (most often strikes people in their 20s) and apparently was showing some of the symptoms such as delusions and believing he is being mind controlled.

          Personally, I would not take a gun with me when I fly as I don't trust the airline not to lose it or have it get stolen. Anything of high value goes with me onto the plane and since a gun cannot, it stays home in the safe.
          According to CNN, he was known by the FBI to be mentally ill, yet this did not prevent him from possessing a gun and checking a gun onto an airplane. And ammo, obviously.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Evan View Post
            According to CNN, he was known by the FBI to be mentally ill, yet this did not prevent him from possessing a gun and checking a gun onto an airplane. And ammo, obviously.
            He was an untreated Vet who came back from Iraq with problems. This is a repeated pattern. It has nothing to do with gun policy at airports and everything to do with the way unwell vets are treated, or not.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Schwartz View Post
              He was an untreated Vet who came back from Iraq with problems. This is a repeated pattern. It has nothing to do with gun policy at airports and everything to do with the way unwell vets are treated, or not.
              RIght. A vet who declared in an FBI interview that he was mentally unstable and hearing voices was granted a gun permit and subsequently allowed to fly on an airplane with a checked firearm... has nothing to do with gun policy at airports...

              RIght...

              If I may quote the President of the United States, "What is it going to take?"

              A good place to start would be denying guns to known mentally unstable people and definitely not letting them check guns on airplanes.

              Comment


              • #8
                Not letting check guns is complicated and not very effective.

                When you check in a gun, the gun is out of reach once the pax is in the secure zone (after TSA screening) and while on the plane of course.

                The baggage conveyors are NOT in the secure zone of airports. You can park your car and walk in to the baggage claim zone carrying a gun and there is no stopping you. So the zones of the airport that are out of the TSA perimeter as susceptible to guns, whether they come in checked bags or concealed in someone's waist.

                And, to say that someone has the right to have a gun for hunting but cannot take it with him to the hunting place would be a little bit contradictory.

                The problem is more what are the rules that govern the acquisition and possession of guns. I am sorry for the 2nd amendment but it cannot be an almost unrestricted right, as well as the right of property or the right of speech are not unlimited (or the right to use public roads, for the sake of it). Specially, mentally ill persons (with certain mental illnesses at least) should not be entitled to that right, as well as they are not entitled a driving licence, let alone a pilot certificate. Ok, these are privileges, unlike the carry of guns that is a right. But still.

                --- Judge what is said by the merits of what is said, not by the credentials of who said it. ---
                --- Defend what you say with arguments, not by imposing your credentials ---

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Gabriel View Post
                  Not letting check guns is complicated and not very effective.

                  When you check in a gun, the gun is out of reach once the pax is in the secure zone (after TSA screening) and while on the plane of course.

                  The baggage conveyors are NOT in the secure zone of airports. You can park your car and walk in to the baggage claim zone carrying a gun and there is no stopping you. So the zones of the airport that are out of the TSA perimeter as susceptible to guns, whether they come in checked bags or concealed in someone's waist.

                  And, to say that someone has the right to have a gun for hunting but cannot take it with him to the hunting place would be a little bit contradictory.

                  The problem is more what are the rules that govern the acquisition and possession of guns.
                  Ok, here's what I'm saying about airports and guns:

                  1) Baggage claim should always be a secure area (in many airports it already is)

                  2) Checked guns should be considered 'hazardous cargo', requiring special handling. In particular, they should be required to be checked in separate cases that are inspected to assure that they are unloaded. In baggage claim, they should be retrieved in the 'special handling' area after being checked as unloaded. Ammunition should be prohibited altogether, if it is not already, and should be detected in baggage xrays. A passenger attempting to convey ammunition should be taken off the flight and prosecuted.

                  So there you can transport your precious gun without the possibility of this scenario recurring.

                  Of course, that's not gonna happen because......

                  am sorry for the 2nd amendment but it cannot be an almost unrestricted right, as well as the right of property or the right of speech are not unlimited...
                  The 2nd Amendment, a glaring anachronism that needs to be stricken out of the US Constitution, allows people the right to keep and bear arms (muskets) for the purpose of forming state militias to defend against possible tyranny overthrowing a very young government without a massive standing army of its own. It has no place in the modern era and it does not grant people the right to walk about with concealed semi-automatic weapons for the purpose of vigilante justice or because they distrust everyone around them. That would be the wild west, which we put well in the past.

                  Specially, mentally ill persons (with certain mental illnesses at least) should not be entitled to that right, as well as they are not entitled a driving licence, let alone a pilot certificate. Ok, these are privileges, unlike the carry of guns that is a right. But still.
                  This goes without saying. Yet nothing is done about it.

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                  • #10
                    In every airport I've been through, and that's a lot, including US airports you cannot enter the baggage area from land side. As a flight arrival you go through immigration, then the baggage hall and finally customs. I'm not going to get into any gun control arguments apart from wondering why you would want to carry a gun on your travels. I think the ease a gun can be owned and carried in the US is fucking insane.
                    If it 'ain't broken........ Don't try to mend it !

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yeah, it's almost as if our national policy of ignoring mental illness in the hope it will go away isn't working!
                      Be alert! America needs more lerts.

                      Eric Law

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by B757300 View Post
                        A declared, unloaded, firearm in a locked case can be in checked baggage. It is no more dangerous than a club.
                        Seriously?

                        The last box of ammo I looked at said "dangerous within one mile" on it. Please cite an example of anyone ever doing harm to someone from a mile away with a club.

                        Edit: as usual, my brain is a little slower than my fingers... you were comparing an unloaded firearm to a club which IMHO is sensible. But... can't an unloaded firearm be packed with a box of ammo right next to it? In that case in a few seconds it can become a loaded firearm, and much more dangerous.
                        Be alert! America needs more lerts.

                        Eric Law

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          There are numerous US airports where it's possible to enter certain baggage claim areas without any checks, straight off the street in fact. These flow from domestic only flights, but they can be part of major high profile airports such as Newark or Washington Reagan. This is a throwback to the pre-9/11 era when people were able to greet arriving domestic passengers at the actual gate.

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                          • #14
                            That's certainly true at BOS. At all the domestic terminals you can enter the baggage claim area right from the street with no security check. Or via escalators/elevators/stairs from the departures floor for maximum convenience... again with no security check.
                            Be alert! America needs more lerts.

                            Eric Law

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by brianw999 View Post
                              I think the ease a gun can be owned and carried in the US is fucking insane.
                              But... but... we need those guns!

                              To defend ourselves against all the other people that have guns.
                              Be alert! America needs more lerts.

                              Eric Law

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