Bad Info - Genre [Archive] - JetPhotos.Net Forums

04-23-2007, 11:47 PM

Please post your queries about Genre info here!

Bruce

06-08-2007, 07:22 AM

How about a warbird? Not actively flying for the military but painted in former mil colors, carrying a civilian registration. Should this be military genre?

06-08-2007, 07:50 AM

No Bruce, if it is on the civil register it should appear as 'Civilian' with the Warbird/Vintage category selected.

Bruce

06-08-2007, 08:33 AM

thanks!

Jez

08-22-2007, 12:19 PM

Just had a few rejections for 'Genre'.

To me, 'Genre' means style, type or class, so an aircraft that was conceived and designed to serve in the military should remain within the 'Military' genre irrespective of its current operator.

From the information given above by AJ, it appears that the term 'Genre' is being misused in this context and maybe should be changed to 'Operator'. At the very least, an explanation should be added to the upload page to clarify matters.

Thoughts?

seahawk

08-22-2007, 12:38 PM

Jez

08-22-2007, 12:49 PM

Like I say, maybe a change of wording would be in order to make things clearer. It should be changed to 'Genre' of the aircraft OPERATOR, rather than 'Genre' of the aircraft itself, as it appears that the 'Genre' of the aircraft is actually irrelevant in this instance.

08-22-2007, 01:28 PM

Jez

08-22-2007, 01:54 PM

In all honesty Jez we don't get many issues with the use of genre. It doesn't seem to cause much confusion.

The 'Operator' of the aircraft is listed in the airline field. Your use of 'Private' in this field would refer to a civilian operator!

I've not had any issues with 'genre' either until now.

If, as you say, the 'genre' is defined by the 'operator' field, then why bother having the 'genre' field at all?

Let's say that I'm a punter that's only interested in military aircraft (which I happen to be) and don't really care about the operator of such aircraft. I go to your front page, select military in the 'genre' drop-down. From this search I would expect to see all of the military aircraft in the database, but in actual fact I only get to see the aicraft that are operated by the military. Do you see my point? I'm missing out on the civilian registered military type/style/genre aircraft.

08-22-2007, 02:26 PM

That is the main reason we have the 'Warbird' category.

Jez

08-22-2007, 02:37 PM

But I just don't just want to see Warbirds (which, BTW is not even a searchable category from the front page drop-down), I want to see all Military style/type/genre aircraft.

The fact that there is a 'Genre' field and an 'Airline/Operator' field implies that they are independant of each another and it is permissable to have a military aircraft with a civilian operator. You have now informed me that they are dependant on each other, so I ask again. Why the two fields?

08-22-2007, 04:03 PM

Jez, Chris and Gabe have spent many hours writing scripts to categorise and sort photo data. 99.99% of visitors seem to have no problem navigating the site and finding the photos they desire. I clearly am unable to satisfy your wants for the site so may I suggest emailing the administration address with your concerns.

ollieholmes

08-22-2007, 06:19 PM

Simpler :

civil registration -> civil in most cases (some Air Force do use civil regs as well ,olike France fro example)

military -> military reg.

So if a former military aircraft joins the warbird circus it becomes civil. Otherwise we woudl soon having even more complicated discussions. Is a Cessna O-1 now in civil hands military or civil according to oyur defintion ?

How about a situation recantly where an ex RAF Hunter was on the G- reg but placed back onto the RAF register but is still civilian owned and flown i believe by civilian pilots?

seahawk

08-22-2007, 06:25 PM

In that case I would recommend to check civil because of the civil registration. However I would also accept military (or change to civil in screening) with the info you just gave. Kind of a borderline case, were there are good reasons for both genres.

mnazarinia

02-25-2008, 12:25 PM

Hi All,
Is the category of something like VH-XSA or even VH-BOB Warbird and also small prop?

Thanks,
Mehdi.

degi

02-25-2008, 12:48 PM

Hi All,
Is the category of something like VH-XSA or even VH-BOB Warbird and also small prop?

Thanks,
Mehdi.

I think you should only tick the Warbird category in reference to the category thread you can find here: http://forums.jetphotos.net/showthread.php?t=41981

Omar Alex Saffe

02-25-2008, 02:39 PM

Yes only warbird category and civilian genre. Thanks

mnazarinia

02-25-2008, 10:48 PM

Thanks all.

SkyNevada

03-09-2008, 12:38 PM

Hello,

No surprise here - I'm confused. Here's why - In Vegas where I live we have airplanes that fly out to the top-secret (yep, top-secret!) Area 51. I have plenty of photos of them in the data base. I always upload them at 'Military' for the Genre.

Today, I had one rejected for 'Genre' Here's the link:

N5175U (http://www.jetphotos.net/viewreject_b.php?id=1824098)

Here is info from FAA:

<table summary="This table charts the registered owner information" width="100%"><caption>Registered Owner (for N5175U (http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNumSQL.asp?NNumbertxt=5175U&cmndfind.x=0&cmndfind.y=0))

</caption> <tbody><tr> <td align="left">Name</td> <td> </td> <td>DEPARTMENT OF THE AIR FORCE </td> </tr> <tr><td align="left">Street</td> <td>
</td> <td align="left"> PO BOX 1504 </td></tr> <tr> <td align="left">City</td> <td>
</td> <td> LAYTON </td><td>State</td> <td>UTAH </td> <td> </td> <td>Zip Code</td> <td> 84041-6504 </td></tr> <tr><td align="left">County</td> <td>
</td> <td> DAVIS </td></tr> <tr><td>Country</td> <td>
</td> <td> UNITED STATES</td></tr></tbody></table>
I appealled the photo with basically the explaination above. My appeall got rejected. Here's the explaination from the Screener:

'Your appeal for photo id 1824098 has been processed and has been rejected.
Admin Comments >> this a/c has a civil reg and needs the \"civilian\" genre.'

Is not the Department of the Air Force Military in nature?

03-09-2008, 06:52 PM

Let me investigate it further please Brad.

SkyNevada

03-09-2008, 08:40 PM

Ok, thanks AJ. By the way, while I was writing that post, I had an EG&G photo that was in the queue marked as 'Military' get accepted.

N5176Y (http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=6195135&nseq=0)

03-10-2008, 05:39 AM

Thanks mate.

From what I can establish the USAF does own the aircraft, however they are operated by a defence contractor, being EG&G under the nickname Janet Airlines.

To follow our guidelines info is listed as the Operator, which being EG&G means a civilian company, therefore civilian genre!

SkyNevada

03-10-2008, 11:33 AM

Hi AJ,

Thanks for the quick response and an answer that is more difinitive. Well, in the future when uploading 'Janet', I'll check the 'Civillian' box instead of 'Military' and if they get rejected for 'Genre', I'll just refer my rejecting screener to this thread. Thanks again for your time and hope all is well...

Bruce

03-22-2008, 07:14 AM

Regarding a cockpit photo of a B-17, I got rejected for genre and category. The auto-fill came up with military. It has a civilian reg#, so is it not supposed to be military? Now I'm confused. Also for genre, I checked cockpit but I'm guessing I should also check "warbird"?? I'm not sure if I did but I probably didn't. I wish the rejection list would include what categories/genres you selected because I'll never remember!

03-22-2008, 07:16 AM

Yeah, you should also have checked 'Warbird/Vintage' Bruce.

As for the B-17 in question, yes, it is now in Civilian hands on the N register.

Paul Stam

07-31-2009, 02:55 PM

Goodday,

Your opinion please about this problem:

My latest rejections are the airlpanes of Marche Verte. They were partially rejected for wrong genre. I uploaded them as civil aircraft, because of the civil registration. I did that because I read the upload rules belonging to genres and the rule said:

Only two options here and the Auto-Fill should select the correct genre automatically on most occasions. The Genre is based on the current registration worn by the aircraft.

The registrations started with CN- ... is a civil registration. And the airplanes are standing in the civil register of Morcco
http://www.brugier.com/n_cn.htm#CN-AAA

Nevertheless the photos were rejected.   __________________

seahawk

07-31-2009, 05:40 PM

If you enter CN-ABT into the database at scramble you will find the plane listed as belonging to Morocco - Air Force.

So, yes it is indeed a military aircraft with a civil registration, which is not that uncommon. The French do this with the Alphajets of the PdF and their A340s are also dual registered.

Paul Stam

07-31-2009, 07:21 PM

Thanks Stefan, I shall upload them in the future as military.

But when I uploaded these photos I was convinced that they are civil, by the registration, but also the type. A CAP-232 is not really built as a military airplane.

To be sure I read the JP rule for genre and when I read this:
The Genre is based on the current Registration worn by the aircraft.
I was sure I had to choose for civil.

Or do I have to read the rule in a other way??

seahawk

07-31-2009, 07:28 PM

As with every rule, there are always some strange exceptions.

Those Marche Verte are civil registered, yet belong to the Air Force of Morroco. On the other side you have planes like the P-180 of Italy´s Guardia di Financia. Operator is not an air Force, yet the plane carries a military reg and in that case it should be up-loaded as military.

It is impossbile to find one rule that fits all circumstances. If in doubt we are glad to help, if you ask in the forums before up-loading. It saves all sides a lot of time and frustration.