Jetphotos.net VS Airliners.net

[Thomas_Cook_757-200]

Hi all, I was just wondering which of these two websites you think are the best:

Jetphotos (http://www.jetphotos.net)

Airliners (http://www.airliners.net)

In my opinion I'm glad Jetphotos.net came along because Airliners.net just got SO BORING, the dark blue dull background, the server forever going down, people in efect changing the topic of posts that you make in the forum so you never end up getting the answer you are after. Then Jetphotos.net, A nice bright background, clear forums, you actually get your answers in the forum, and the server has never been down-at least not while i've been on anyway! laff.gif

Thanks

jmc_757-200 heart.gif JMC

[SST2707]

Please no. images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

[tommyalf]

I personally like both sites. Jetphoto's interface is refreshing and easy to look at. The users of the message boards don't seem to treat each other like children when one disagrees with another. A.Net is certainly larger and has more to offer on the message boards. Although I’m getting tired of the U.S.A bashing and the moderators doing nothing about, but if your American and say something bad about another country you quickly get deleted.

As far as pics, I'm very impressed how many pictures Jetphoto's has already. All in all both are great sites but Jetphoto’s is an American ran site, and I’m always partial to the red, white, and blue.

[crossin]

Chris, I remember your last site. It closed with a reason that you couldn't afford to run it. Can you explain how this one will be supported. i am not keen on uploading a lot of images only to find another email in my mailbox telling me that it is closing again.

[Braniffnut]

Well, I certainly believe that J.P. is going to give A.Net a run for it's money in the future, I mean 10,000 pics in only 2 months, I don't think that Planepictures has grown that fast. I too rather like the look of this site. I still very much enjoy A.Net as well and for the time being and let's face it, it is the place for your work to be seen by the right people, a.k.a. buyers! Though I believe that J.P. with the right promotion can catch the eyes of A.D.s and other buyers.

As for the lack of server clitches thus far, well with all respect to Chris and the others, this is still a very new site and when this site really takes off I would expect to see some (not all) of the problems that have plagued A.Net to show up here. After all things do break down every so often, especially when you have a popular site. I just hope that the egos will remain in check.

Anti-Americanism on A.Net......naaaahhhhhh! Then again it is a European dominated site, so that goes without saying. Frankly, it has been hip to be anti-American since '1945'. After all we are the most evil, oppressive nation on the planet, bent on total domination or destruction! images/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Thomas

[mirrodie]

I like airliners.net but do love this refreshed look that this site offers. What's more, I have a ton of sweet train photos to upload too!

Airliners.net and this site are very different though. I think that many awesome photos that "might" have made it on airliners.net never will b/c of the stringent specs.

I mean, I have loads of plane and train photos. My train photos are better b/c of the perspectives I used. But I am not a WHIZ at scanning, so many uploads that could have been, weren't.

So I think this site has some great exciting photos that anet may not have.

peace, mirrodie

[hkgspotter1]

I do hope this site will keep running as its doing great.

Tom,

The America issue, sorry to say unless the US keeps out of other countries business it will never stop.

[Robert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hkgspotter1:
I do hope this site will keep running as its doing great.

Tom,

The America issue, sorry to say unless the US keeps out of other countries business it will never stop.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

skeptical.gif
What would you be saying right now if we would have first attacked Afghanistan? Look what happened, if we would have acted before they attacked us I guarantee it that you and all these other anti-attack Iraq people would been saying "oh that isnt fair, etc."

YOU don't know the reasons why we are after Iraq, unless of course you get a daily breifing from the UN?

I highly doubt Bush is gonna take any chances after 9'11 and if Iraq could attack us I'm sure he wouldnt hesitate.
Either way its for our safety and the countries around Iraq.


But either way what do we have to do with our government?
Plenty of Americans didnt vote for Bush. (I voted for him!) If Bush wants to attack Iraq do you think I can call him up on the phone and say "No George don't do it."?

If I don't like your government should I bash you and the others who live in your country??

<FONT COLOR="black" SIZE="1">[ December 18, 2002 01:10 PM: Message edited 1 time, lastly by Robert ]</font>

[FinalApproach]

I agree Robert, but this is a free speech forum! I don't want to see a civil war. So I say end the country nonsense. I personally believe there should be no borders and we(the world) should all work as one!

[tommyalf]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hkgspotter1:
I do hope this site will keep running as its doing great.

Tom,

The America issue, sorry to say unless the US keeps out of other countries business it will never stop.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well when most of these countries invite us in and embrace our way of life what should we do? Tell them to take a hike, we'd get beat up for that too. It sure is tough being the greatest country on the face of the earth images/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[Robert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Groundcrew1:
I agree Robert, but this is a free speech forum! I don't want to see a civil war. So I say end the country nonsense. I personally believe there should be no borders and we(the world) should all work as one!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Free speech, yes. But I'm not going to sit back and watch people bash the US. I'll happily listen to their reasons why we are all murderers but I'll also add my 0.02 images/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[ADG]

Robert,

People need to understand what they are arguing about .. 90% of this "US Bashing" occurs in the minds of those accusing everyone of US Bashing.

Also ... 90% of those whinging about people bashing the USA are generally bashing some other country ...


VH-ADG

[Robert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by VH-ADG:
Robert,

People need to understand what they are arguing about .. 90% of this "US Bashing" occurs in the minds of those accusing everyone of US Bashing.

Also ... 90% of those whinging about people bashing the USA are generally bashing some other country ...


VH-ADG<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


First, I never and have never bashed any other country.
Second, don't think like Johan and say that US bashing at A.net is not happening, when we all know it is. Wehn HKG just admitted it does for one thing..
I could point out many many threads, or instances where it has occured and was left alone by the moderators saying the same old "We don't feel it violates any rules."
Yet a thread called "Vermont" does.
Give me a break. Either way I'm not going to get into that because this is JetPhotos not airliners.

[hkgspotter1]

Look I don't want a fight on this forum but the fact is 90% of Americans stand by their President whatever he does. Even if he attacked North Korea they would all support it.

Now as for Iraqi, The USA AND THE UK are going to bomb them whatever happens and they will be VERY WRONG. If you listen to the news these days more and more countries are very pissed about how the USA took the report from the UN and only gave Edited copies to most of the countries in the UN.

As many already know Iraqi is no danger to the US or UK, what they want is Sadam out because they just don't like him and they need to control the oil.

I'm British and I do not think Blair is correct to follow Bush around like a little pet dog. Just yesterday I was on the BBC hearing how the USA want to upgrade some sight they have in the UK to do some Son of Star Wars thing. Only small problem is they want the UK to pay for half of it !!. Something like 10 Million UKP !!

Anyway I don't hate Americans as some think I just don't think they open their eyes to the world, its just USA and nothing else.

My view only.

[Chris Kilroy]

Daryl,

As a moderator, and site administrator, I normally try to stay out of these debates. I will make an exception in this case however...

With all due respect, Daryl, your views are completely misguided, and frankly, many of them are factually incorrect.

Addressing your first point, which asserts that 90% of Americans will support the President no matter what he does -- this is absurd. No American President receives 90% support for something.. EVER. In fact, public support for a war against Iraq is currently at about 55% -- hardly a large majority. And this is a popular issue -- normally the spread is even closer.

Regarding Iraq, and this is going to be a bit longwinded...

You assert that Iraq presents no danger to the United States and the UK. I'd like to know what inside knowledge you have that allows you to make such an irrefutable statement. You don't know, any more than I do, what kind of threat Iraq poses.

Iraq, on almost a daily basis, fires on American and British fighter jets patrolling a U.N. sanctioned no-fly zone over that country. That, to me, alone, is enough to warrant a measured response from the US and Britain. What other country do you know of that could repeatedly fire against U.S. forces and not suffer immediate retalitory action?. I'll answer -- None. If anything, the U.S. has been extremely lenient with Iraq.

However, let's assume for a moment that your assertion that Iraq poses no direct threat to the U.S. and Britain is true.

Do you deny that Iraq poses an immediate threat to Israel, Kuwait, and other surrounding nations and US/Britain allies? Surely you don't. Allies defend one another, and come to each others' aid -- just as the US did for Kuwait when Hussein invaded the country in 1991.

Surely, also, you don't deny the fact that Saddam's regime poses a threat to the very citizens of Iraq. Do a Google search on the plight of women in Iraq. Read the horrible and disgusting reports of how teachers, doctors, etc. were dragged into the streets and executed by beheading in front of hoards of people bussed in to watch the executions all because they were suspected of being prostitutes.

Read the stories of how millions of innocent Iraqis who have spoken out against Hussein's regime or policies, and indeed entire ethnic groups of Iraqis, have been exterminated for their political or religious beliefs.

Then try to defend that. To hide behind the guise of 'that is their right, it is their country, who are we to interfere?' makes a person, in my eyes, no better than those who defended Nazi Germany and the similar atrocities which took place there as well.

To defend gross crimes against humanity as a "country's sovereignty" is just silly and stupid.

Regarding the fact that a number of nations --

I could care less what these nations think. Just because a bunch of pacifist nations who think problems will just go away if they are ignored agree on something doesn't make it right. If you'd like to blame someone for the way the Weapons "Declaration" was distributed, blame the U.N. The U.N. and solely the U.N. was responsible for determining who got what report.

Regarding your assertion that this war is about oil --

Rubbish. Iraq -- rightly or wrongly (in violation of U.N. sanctions) -- illegally sells millions of barrels of oil to oil companies every month at some of the lowest prices available. To assert that a regmine change in Iraq would lower oil prices is not only false, but it shows great ignorance on the part of whomever came up with the stupid claim.

I, frankly, am sick of half the world being upset with the U.S. no matter what we do. Not only that, but verbalizing it so damned frequently. Fact is, we are damned if we do, and damned if we don't.

If we interfere in a situation like Iraq, we are accused of "policing the World." But when hostile situations erupt, who are the first people called for help every damned time? You're right! WE ARE!

Other nations of the world do not have the right to pick and choose what situations they feel our country should be involved in. If our country sees a situation like the one in Iraq -- with threats against us, our allies, and indeed innocent civilians of that country -- it is our responsibility to act. As I said before, the fact that some other nations disagree does not make their opinion right. It simple shows where they stand.

This country provides far, far more foreign aide to impoverished nations and peoples than any other country out there. Yet we are seen, by many, as the fashionable target of bashers 'round the world. I do not know if it's jealousy, envy, ignorance, genuine stupidity, or a dangerous combination of all of them -- but it sucks, and I'm sick and tired of it.

If I had my way, any country receiving any foreign aide from the U.S. would be required to show complete, unilateral support for our positions, and our people. If this was not done, all foreign aid would cease immediately.

Now before you run and say that the U.S. has no right to demand complete support from other countries, I'll say it first. You're absolutely right! But likewise, the U.S. has no obligation to provide any foreign aide to anyone.

To read this kind of garbage on Airliners.Net is one thing -- I would expect it there. But to read it from someone whom, otherwise, I've always considered to be a reasonable and respectable person really surprises me, and makes me sad.

[Southwest737]

All I gotta say to Chris Kilroy is this...

WOW!!!!!! images/smiles/icon_eek.gif images/smiles/icon_eek.gif images/smiles/icon_eek.gif images/smiles/icon_eek.gif clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif

[Robert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Chris Kilroy:
Daryl,

As a moderator, and site administrator, I normally try to stay out of these debates. I will make an exception in this case however...

With all due respect, Daryl, your views are completely misguided, and frankly, many of them are factually incorrect.

Addressing your first point, which asserts that 90% of Americans will support the President no matter what he does -- this is absurd. No American President receives 90% support for something.. EVER. In fact, public support for a war against Iraq is currently at about 55% -- hardly a large majority. And this is a popular issue -- normally the spread is even closer.

Regarding Iraq, and this is going to be a bit longwinded...

You assert that Iraq presents no danger to the United States and the UK. I'd like to know what inside knowledge you have that allows you to make such an irrefutable statement. You don't know, any more than I do, what kind of threat Iraq poses.

Iraq, on almost a daily basis, fires on American and British fighter jets patrolling a U.N. sanctioned no-fly zone over that country. That, to me, alone, is enough to warrant a measured response from the US and Britain. What other country do you know of that could repeatedly fire against U.S. forces and not suffer immediate retalitory action?. I'll answer -- None. If anything, the U.S. has been extremely lenient with Iraq.

However, let's assume for a moment that your assertion that Iraq poses no direct threat to the U.S. and Britain is true.

Do you deny that Iraq poses an immediate threat to Israel, Kuwait, and other surrounding nations and US/Britain allies? Surely you don't. Allies defend one another, and come to each others' aid -- just as the US did for Kuwait when Hussein invaded the country in 1991.

Surely, also, you don't deny the fact that Saddam's regime poses a threat to the very citizens of Iraq. Do a Google search on the plight of women in Iraq. Read the horrible and disgusting reports of how teachers, doctors, etc. were dragged into the streets and executed by beheading in front of hoards of people bussed in to watch the executions all because they were suspected of being prostitutes.

Read the stories of how millions of innocent Iraqis who have spoken out against Hussein's regime or policies, and indeed entire ethnic groups of Iraqis, have been exterminated for their political or religious beliefs.

Then try to defend that. To hide behind the guise of 'that is their right, it is their country, who are we to interfere?' makes a person, in my eyes, no better than those who defended Nazi Germany and the similar atrocities which took place there as well.

To defend gross crimes against humanity as a "country's sovereignty" is just silly and stupid.

Regarding the fact that a number of nations --

I could care less what these nations think. Just because a bunch of pacifist nations who think problems will just go away if they are ignored agree on something doesn't make it right. If you'd like to blame someone for the way the Weapons "Declaration" was distributed, blame the U.N. The U.N. and solely the U.N. was responsible for determining who got what report.

Regarding your assertion that this war is about oil --

Rubbish. Iraq -- rightly or wrongly (in violation of U.N. sanctions) -- illegally sells millions of barrels of oil to oil companies every month at some of the lowest prices available. To assert that a regmine change in Iraq would lower oil prices is not only false, but it shows great ignorance on the part of whomever came up with the stupid claim.

I, frankly, am sick of half the world being upset with the U.S. no matter what we do. Not only that, but verbalizing it so damned frequently. Fact is, we are damned if we do, and damned if we don't.

If we interfere in a situation like Iraq, we are accused of "policing the World." But when hostile situations erupt, who are the first people called for help every damned time? You're right! WE ARE!

Other nations of the world do not have the right to pick and choose what situations they feel our country should be involved in. If our country sees a situation like the one in Iraq -- with threats against us, our allies, and indeed innocent civilians of that country -- it is our responsibility to act. As I said before, the fact that some other nations disagree does not make their opinion right. It simple shows where they stand.

This country provides far, far more foreign aide to impoverished nations and peoples than any other country out there. Yet we are seen, by many, as the fashionable target of bashers 'round the world. I do not know if it's jealousy, envy, ignorance, genuine stupidity, or a dangerous combination of all of them -- but it sucks, and I'm sick and tired of it.

If I had my way, any country receiving any foreign aide from the U.S. would be required to show complete, unilateral support for our positions, and our people. If this was not done, all foreign aid would cease immediately.

Now before you run and say that the U.S. has no right to demand complete support from other countries, I'll say it first. You're absolutely right! But likewise, the U.S. has no obligation to provide any foreign aide to anyone.

To read this kind of garbage on Airliners.Net is one thing -- I would expect it there. But to read it from someone whom, otherwise, I've always considered to be a reasonable and respectable person really surprises me, and makes me sad.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Very, very well said Chris!
I could'nt agree more.
I find it funny when people have all this "intelligence" about the US and other countries.
It sounds like HKG knows more then the UN, maybe they should join teams?
smilewink.gif
Honestly though, unless you recieve a daily breifing from Dubya himself you have NO idea what our reasons are.
If you think Saddam is not a threat to us or anyone else, your crazy.

[ADG]

Conversely i'd be interested in what knowledge you have that proves that Iraq is a threat to the US or the UK? Seems to me that he doesn't have the capability to launch anything that far, he has never instigated a terrorist attack against America. Just as you can't say for a fact that he cannot, you cannot say he will. I dont' think he's even threatened the US has he? (and I could be wrong there, it's all got pretty boring actually).

Yes, he fires on these people who fly over his own country, but that does not indicate a direct theat on the United States now does it? It simply indicates that the little man (David) is waving his fist at the big guy (Goliath). Don't get me wrong, i'm not supporting Iraq, but I think the statements you guys are making are wrong. Firing at planes flying over your own airspace is not a threat against that country which is the claim being made.

And when you speak about retaliation you must remember that if those planes weren't flying over Iraqi airspace they wouldn't be being fired upon would they? If you don't like it, don't fly there.

There are other alternatives than rubbing the Iraqi peoples nose in the fact that the big bad superpowers can kick their botties any time they wish. Sure he shouldnt' respond, but what would others do in the same situation?

The assertion that Iraq poses no direct threat to the United States IS TRUE.

As for Israeli, Kuwait and other nations, i'm not even sure they are an immediate threat to those although they do pose a threat, just as Isreal does to the countries around it and the US does to 1/2 the world!

Allies defend each other AFTER being attacked, they don't attack countries on the off chance that an attack may occur. That goes way beyond defence and into the being exactly what you accuse Iraq of being. When Iraq becomes a direct threat, and not just in the minds of people who see those who are different as a threat, then the US have a right to intervene as they did in Kuwait in 1991.

Sure Saddams regime should end, but then so should Magabe's, but who is whinging about that? and what about when a full THIRD of the East Timorese people were murdered by the Indonesians? Do I need to drag out all these examples of countries being ignored whilst Hussein, is being focussed upon?

When you talk about atrocities, bear in mind the country in which a man was chained to a car and dragged to his death by people who didn't like him simply because of the colour of his skin. Every country has atrocities, even my own. I'm not disagreeing with you, but you do need to remember that in the big scheme, these things happen from time to time.

And also remember that the plight of women (etc) was pretty irrelevant to your country for the 25 years that they suffered in Afghanistan and would still be irrelevant had one ugly mother not decided to build his home in the underground housing available there. So please don't drag that out as an *excuse* to bomb Hussein. If only human rights were the reason for action, then maybe we'd see a little more action in places where it is needed rather than just in the areas where pride and oil are issues.

When you are complaining about Iraqs treatment of people you need to remember that on the list of items banned by the embargo are the medicines and equipment that are required to treat life threatining medical issues such as cancer. This is a list drawn up by the US for the UN, the peoples suffering in Iraq isn't solely the responsibility of Hussein, we also share blame for enforcing an embargo for 11 years that we all know isn't working. But again, pride comes into force, rather than looking for an alternate solution, some won't conceed that they screwed up in the first place and have been directly responsible (with Hussein) for the death of over 1.5 million people, a full third of them babies!

You can read all the stories you like, but then read stories about other countries. Iraq is not alone in their treatment of their people! In other countries they have been exterminated simply because of the colour of their skin!

evil.gif

I don't think you can defend the human rights atrocities that go on in Iraq although we cannot know how much of it is nothing more than propoganda or isolated incidents. Indeed I can think of countries who the US support who appear to be every bit as bad as Iraq as well as countries that the US ignores.

and lets clear it up, I don't support Iraq in any way, with the UN mandate to attack I support the attack on Iraq but I do not support a US lead leadership in Iraq, even in the short term.

I do not appreciate the attack on other nations who's beliefs do not align with yours, you need to have a serious think about that attitude because, quite frankly, Hussein doesn't care what other nations think either and I make that distinction deliberately.

When you fail to consider the opinions of others you become exactly what you despise the most.

Iraq has violated 16 UN resolutions, I can think of another country that has violated 68 and they are not being threatened in any way.

If you are sick of half the world being upset with the US then you should sit back and have a serious think about why these people are upset. You can discount those who are upset simply because you're not muslim, they're irrelevant but there are people out there with definite grievances against the US for a variety of reasons and many, quite frankly, are valid. Some obviously are not valid. But unless you look at the issues properly these people will continue to be upset and the US response seems to simply be "do what we want or we will destroy you". Another reason why people are upset I suspect.

No matter what you do? How can you say that when the majority of the grievances are being absolutely ignored? How do you know you're damed if you don't if you don't try it?

Example: Illegal Trade Subsidies. What do you know about those? They are bankrupting Australian farmers at a rate of 1 a day and have been declared illegal by that World Court thingie and yet the US tells us they have every right to do what they do (put their people first). And in an absolute show of the ultimate hypocrisy, the US has run to that very same court complaining that the Airbus subsidies should be illegal because it's destroying Boeing.

Where is the credibility? And where is the concern for your "allies"? Allies when you want them, other than they they can go f... themselves huh?

Mind you, when you want our support you dangle "free trade" as an option under our nose knowing that we have no choice but to follow you in the hope that it's not just an empty offer to get us in Iraq.

You're not the "first people that are called every time" at all Chris. I find that insulting. Are your troops in, or have they ever been in, East Timor? We're they the first called there? No. You are not the first called and you are not the first in. You go in with your allies, the US/UK/Canada/Australia and others. Even in Kuwait YOU did not attack, the Allies did. You insult your allies when you make statements like that.

Actually other countries do get the right to pick and choose your situations, these countries are the representatives of the United Nations. America does not have, simply by virtue of it's size, carte blance to do what it likes. It's the attitude that they do that is making it one of the most hated countries in the world, America appears to be everything that communism was 20 years ago.

Sure America can make decisions that other countries do not agree with, no one can stop the big superpower. That neither makes the decisions right nor gives you the right to tell others to shut up. Indeed, I would think that the fact that you claim to be a democracy and you claim to be an ally gives us the right to have our say about the decisions, and America should listen. Whether they choose to act on what others say, is as you say, their decision. But to complain when people say something whilst declaring to be the most free and reasonable country in the world is pretty hypocritical don't you think?

As for foreign aid, yes your country supplies lots, but what happens when you look at the "per capita" figure? It falls well below that of other countries. Indeed the country above you takes in 3x the refugees your country does per capita. A country of 20,000,000 people cannot give the same aid in $ value than a country of 285,000,000 people but divide the figure by the number of citizens and a totally different story is told.

Add to that the fact that many countries only need foriegn aid because their plight has been ignored to the point where they are in such a bad situation that they can no longer support themselves. That's before we even start on the foreign aid given to countries that do not need it, and that are considered by some to be terrorist regimes.

A country is not "bashed" simply because it is fashionable, many of those who complain have, IMO, valid reasons to complain (and of course many do not).

It's not about jealousy, envy or genuine stupidity, that type of statement is simply stupid. It simply allows you to ignore what others are saying which is a dangerously simplistic way to behave.

You're sick and tired of the US bashing? Ever considered that others are sick and tired of being told how wonderful the US is? Are sick and tired of being victims to the US first policies? Are sick and tired of the wars being waged in the world? In reality, America has been waging war since the War of Independance. It's even gone so far as to war against itself! (not many countries can claim that!).

Then you tell us that if you had your way the US would only support those who totally support it, where is the democracy in that Chris? I've heard that type of thinking before somewhere .... (ponders where).

So America should only support those who bow down to the mighty superpower? I can't believe you have suggested such a thing. I pity you.

What makes me really sad is to see what you have written. Not the pro US stuff because that's your right but the underlying message that others must give you absolute support without question. I'm pretty sure that's the problem that you guys had with the communists wasn't it? Have you become what you despise the most?

I'd much rather live in a country that allows others to have their own opinions that one that demands absolute support without question.

offtopic1.gif

[PolishAir42]

Bron that was possibly the stupidest **** ive heard in a long time..

Kudos to you for a useless, lying, biased post.

I mean seriously...Did you copy that from Greenpeace or something?

[PolishAir42]

"Conversely i'd be interested in what knowledge you have that proves that Iraq is a threat to the US or the UK? Seems to me that he doesn't have the capability to launch anything that far, he has never instigated a terrorist attack against America. Just as you can't say for a fact that he cannot, you cannot say he will. I dont' think he's even threatened the US has he? (and I could be wrong there, it's all got pretty boring actually)."

How about Saddam trying to buy WMD, how about Saddam sponsoring terriorists, how about Saddam using chemical weapons on his own civilians.

"Yes, he fires on these people who fly over his own country, but that does not indicate a direct theat on the United States now does it? It simply indicates that the little man (David) is waving his fist at the big guy (Goliath). Don't get me wrong, i'm not supporting Iraq, but I think the statements you guys are making are wrong. Firing at planes flying over your own airspace is not a threat against that country which is the claim being made."

This has NOTHING to do with Goliath or David...this has to do with a madman and the US who is trying to put him were he belongs, in jail and finally on the friggin execution table.

"And when you speak about retaliation you must remember that if those planes weren't flying over Iraqi airspace they wouldn't be being fired upon would they? If you don't like it, don't fly there. "

Dont make me laugh....we patrol the no fly zone so he dosent sneak behind our backs in the air, and install more defenses.

"The assertion that Iraq poses no direct threat to the United States IS TRUE."

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. And the terrorists are not a direct threat to the US.

"Allies defend each other AFTER being attacked, they don't attack countries on the off chance that an attack may occur. That goes way beyond defence and into the being exactly what you accuse Iraq of being. When Iraq becomes a direct threat, and not just in the minds of people who see those who are different as a threat, then the US have a right to intervene as they did in Kuwait in 1991."

Your thinking is so blind Im just amazed...WE ARE TRYING TO STOP IT BEFORE IT HAPPENS! What? you want us to sit around like Chamberlain did before WW2?? Oh sure...why dont we just wait until he kills a couple million...

"Sure Saddams regime should end, but then so should Magabe's, but who is whinging about that? and what about when a full THIRD of the East Timorese people were murdered by the Indonesians? Do I need to drag out all these examples of countries being ignored whilst Hussein, is being focussed upon?"

That would be Mugabe...AFAIK the Indonesian and Zimbabwe's govs. arent giving terrorists money, and logistical support, and if that not at the scale Iraq is.

"When you talk about atrocities, bear in mind the country in which a man was chained to a car and dragged to his death by people who didn't like him simply because of the colour of his skin. Every country has atrocities, even my own. I'm not disagreeing with you, but you do need to remember that in the big scheme, these things happen from time to time."

When an attrocity becomes a commonplace and mass its not considered that. And that is exactly whats happening in Iraq.

"So please don't drag that out as an *excuse* to bomb Hussein. If only human rights were the reason for action, then maybe we'd see a little more action in places where it is needed rather than just in the areas where pride and oil are issues"

That a typical non-american myth. Everything we bomb is for oil...So when we had campaigns in Somalia, Panama, Grenada and Serbia that was for oil too? Oh yea I bet you can get a real tankerloads of it from those places.

"When you are complaining about Iraqs treatment of people you need to remember that on the list of items banned by the embargo are the medicines and equipment that are required to treat life threatining medical issues such as cancer. This is a list drawn up by the US for the UN, the peoples suffering in Iraq isn't solely the responsibility of Hussein, we also share blame for enforcing an embargo for 11 years that we all know isn't working. But again, pride comes into force, rather than looking for an alternate solution, some won't conceed that they screwed up in the first place and have been directly responsible (with Hussein) for the death of over 1.5 million people, a full third of them babies!"

Saddam is using civilians as a human shield. BS we share the responsibility...as i said. Nothing more than a big human shield..and a way for Saddam to make the US look evil.

"Indeed I can think of countries who the US support who appear to be every bit as bad as Iraq as well as countries that the US ignores."

Name a country the US supports fully that that countries gov. uses chemical weapons on its civilians, takes over other nations, initiates in mass murders etc.

"I do not appreciate the attack on other nations who's beliefs do not align with yours, you need to have a serious think about that attitude because, quite frankly, Hussein doesn't care what other nations think either and I make that distinction deliberately."

That is his problem, the he needs to adjust to the world, not the world to his "Im the king of the castle" attitude.

"Iraq has violated 16 UN resolutions, I can think of another country that has violated 68 and they are not being threatened in any way."

No one takes the UN seriously, the UN is a powerless organization right now that cant do squat if the US attacks Iraq. I dont give a rats ass what Mr. Kofi says, his ideas are about as good as Jesse Jacksons. Lets face the facts, the UN is just a puppet organization for the strong Security Council countries and the poorer nations pleading for aid money.

"If you are sick of half the world being upset with the US then you should sit back and have a serious think about why these people are upset. You can discount those who are upset simply because you're not muslim, they're irrelevant but there are people out there with definite grievances against the US for a variety of reasons and many, quite frankly, are valid. Some obviously are not valid. But unless you look at the issues properly these people will continue to be upset and the US response seems to simply be "do what we want or we will destroy you". Another reason why people are upset I suspect."

We dont live in a perfect world, there is no such thing as everyone in country A loves everyone in country B. The US has done far more positive for the world than negative, I can state that with pride and honor.

"No matter what you do? How can you say that when the majority of the grievances are being absolutely ignored? How do you know you're damed if you don't if you don't try it?"

What are you talking about? skeptical.gif

"Example: Illegal Trade Subsidies. What do you know about those? They are bankrupting Australian farmers at a rate of 1 a day and have been declared illegal by that World Court thingie and yet the US tells us they have every right to do what they do (put their people first). And in an absolute show of the ultimate hypocrisy, the US has run to that very same court complaining that the Airbus subsidies should be illegal because it's destroying Boeing."

Oh dear. Every country on this planet tries to protect its home based industry... "World Court thingie" ? The world court is filled with a bunch of liberals who wont even let us execute terrorists...

"Where is the credibility? And where is the concern for your "allies"? Allies when you want them, other than they they can go f... themselves huh?

Mind you, when you want our support you dangle "free trade" as an option under our nose knowing that we have no choice but to follow you in the hope that it's not just an empty offer to get us in Iraq."

laff.gif Good joke, no seriously that was a good laugh.

"You're not the "first people that are called every time" at all Chris. I find that insulting. Are your troops in, or have they ever been in, East Timor? We're they the first called there? No. You are not the first called and you are not the first in. You go in with your allies, the US/UK/Canada/Australia and others. Even in Kuwait YOU did not attack, the Allies did. You insult your allies when you make statements like that."

Oh so now you want us in East Timor??? LOL I thought you just said we should stay at home?

All Chris said was that we do the bulk of the logistical and support. We do COME IN to alot of places first.

"Actually other countries do get the right to pick and choose your situations, these countries are the representatives of the United Nations. America does not have, simply by virtue of it's size, carte blance to do what it likes. It's the attitude that they do that is making it one of the most hated countries in the world, America appears to be everything that communism was 20 years ago."

So now we are communists?

Bron, Guess what I got food stamps from Washington yesterday. I can buy 1 pound of cheese for the month. I also got a 2nd letter. My future career will be a bricklayer, it had a warning on the bottom, if i tried to rebel i would be shot by the FBI.

"As for foreign aid, yes your country supplies lots, but what happens when you look at the "per capita" figure? It falls well below that of other countries. Indeed the country above you takes in 3x the refugees your country does per capita. A country of 20,000,000 people cannot give the same aid in $ value than a country of 285,000,000 people but divide the figure by the number of citizens and a totally different story is told."

We dont have to give aid if we dont want to. Its a choice of free will. What because the US is a rich nation it has to give away free money? I dont think so.

"Add to that the fact that many countries only need foriegn aid because their plight has been ignored to the point where they are in such a bad situation that they can no longer support themselves. That's before we even start on the foreign aid given to countries that do not need it, and that are considered by some to be terrorist regimes."

Starting from the fact that what many African and Asian countries are facing now goes back to the European Colonization age...so I guess the US has to pay for them... skeptical.gif

"You're sick and tired of the US bashing? Ever considered that others are sick and tired of being told how wonderful the US is? Are sick and tired of being victims to the US first policies? Are sick and tired of the wars being waged in the world? In reality, America has been waging war since the War of Independance. It's even gone so far as to war against itself! (not many countries can claim that!)."

Sorry but on other sites...*coughs* I only see US bashing and few people who actually have good things to say. Sick about victims of the US?? Ok Bron, how have you been personally hurt by the US? Fine ok, let me come over to your house and count how many US products you use, that were invented by or supported by the US...what did the US do? Burn down your house?

Waging war?????? BWHAHAHHA We had a civil war, Im proud of the fact that the Union won the war. Not many countries can claim that fact?

Bron: why dont you just ask Russia, England, France and late Germany...they can tell you a thing or two about civil wars...Oh sure...not many countries had them...I think you made that up as you were going along..

"Then you tell us that if you had your way the US would only support those who totally support it, where is the democracy in that Chris? I've heard that type of thinking before somewhere .... (ponders where)."

What is the point of supporting other countries that dont support us????????????

"What makes me really sad is to see what you have written. Not the pro US stuff because that's your right but the underlying message that others must give you absolute support without question. I'm pretty sure that's the problem that you guys had with the communists wasn't it? Have you become what you despise the most?"

Bron do you know what the definition of communism is? No one ever achieved communism, the Soviet Union was at best far socialist. Please dont talk about things you have no idea about. The US is a Republic. In big and fat letters.

[Robert]

clap.gif Peter..

I didnt even read Brons whole post, I fell asleep after the first two lines.

[hkgspotter1]

Chris,

I know that 90% of Americans do not support Bush on the whole but they do on the Iraqi issue.

As for your reply to me I can't say I'm happy with the way you make me look an idiot but not to worry I get that all the time images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

I think the point you and many others miss is this, every day your pumped full of news on how evil these countries are and how the USA/UK is in danger. Living in Asia I get a much more even supply of news, just as I think VH-ADG does down in OZ. I do not support Iraqi but I do not and will not support another attack on Iraqi. The UN are in Iraqi NOW. If there is something evil they will find it, they are not being blocked in any way from their duty so I can't see how the USA/UK can keep saying they have weapons of mass distruction.

Is Sudam a evil man ??, YES, we all know what he's done in the past but hurting a whole country to get at one man will not help.

If the USA could look into the future sometimes and see what a mess they make for other countries in the region of their wars. You will note the war's the US fights are almost never anywhere near home. (Pacific, Vietnam, Iraqi, Afghanistan)

Please try to see views that are not from the USA/UK, this is the biggest problem with this issue.

Look I have no interest to make any anti American posts on your site Chris, you have a great site that you should be very happy with but please do not make the mistake Johan did and block anything thats not with your own thinking.

Now why can't people spend more time looking at Pakistan and India, these are two countries that have the bomb (Confirmed) and could cause a major problem for millions of people images/smiles/icon_confused.gif

Please note I'm not attacking the USA, I've been to the states twice and the people are great. As for your country, I've near seen such amazing places like Yosemite, death Valley, Vegas and Phoenix.

Kind Regards & a Merry Christmas to all.
Daryl

[ADG]

Well Pete, stupid enough that you responded ??

> How about Saddam trying to buy WMD,

How does that directly threaten the US?

> how about Saddam sponsoring terriorists,

Again, which terrorists, in what way and how does that directly threaten the US?

> how about Saddam using chemical weapons on his own
> civilians.

How does that directly threaten the US?

> This has NOTHING to do with Goliath or David...

Little guy/big guy .. certainly does have a correlation.

> this has to do with a madman and the US who is trying to
> put him were he belongs, in jail and finally on the
> friggin execution table.

Firstly I wonder what American laws he has broken that give you jurisdiction over him and secondly what right do you have to execute him?

That goes way beyond the theory of getting him out of power, and again I wonder what he has done to the United States that makes this so personal. I'm willing to be convinced, I am just not seeing any facts yet.

> Dont make me laugh....

Don't make you laugh? Do you know how funny it is when people use the "he fired on our planes in the air over Iraq" as some type of proof that he is a threat to the US. Not by any stretch of the imagination is there any relevance between the two.

> we patrol the no fly zone so he dosent sneak behind our
> backs in the air, and install more defenses.

Behind your backs in the air and install more defences? What does that mean?

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. And the terrorists are not a direct threat to the US.

Which terrorist organisation does Hussein lead exactly? Osama Bin Laden is a direct threat to the US, Hussein right now, is not.

> Your thinking is so blind Im just amazed...

You think? You can't even understand or accept the term direct threat and you call me blind?

> WE ARE TRYING TO STOP IT BEFORE IT HAPPENS!

I think we all understand that thanks Peter, the issue here is that you're trying to stop a direct threat before it becomes a direct threat by saying there is a direct threat when in reality there isn't. Bit of a circular issue really.

> What? you want us to sit around like Chamberlain did
> before WW2?? Oh sure...why dont we just wait until he
> kills a couple million...

I think a couple of million have already been killed in this battle of the egos.

> That would be Mugabe...AFAIK the Indonesian and
> Zimbabwe's govs. arent giving terrorists money, and
> logistical support, and if that not at the scale Iraq
> is.

Your assumptions are wrong, it was the Indonesian military in East Timor causing all the problems, and the military arming the militia that is now attacking western interests in East Timor.

> When an attrocity becomes a commonplace and mass its not
> considered that.

Still covers a lot of other countries.

> That a typical non-american myth. Everything we bomb is
> for oil...

That's not quite what I actually said.

> So when we had campaigns in Somalia, Panama, Grenada and
> Serbia that was for oil too? Oh yea I bet you can get a
> real tankerloads of it from those places.

Interesting that the places you name have issues that could have been resolved in much better ways without the need for violence if action had been taken in a more timely manner.

> Saddam is using civilians as a human shield. BS we share
> the responsibility...as i said. Nothing more than a big
> human shield..and a way for Saddam to make the US look
> evil.

Anyone who contributes to the death of 1.5 million people, half of which are children is evil, my country included.

The UN embargo on Iraq is evil. It might have been a good idea at the time, but it's been proven to have been a really stupid one in hindsight, and yet pride is holding back a re-assessment of the actions.

It's pretty arrogant to blame Hussein for all the suffering in Iraq when those who have placed and are enforcing the embargo know what he is like and deliberately allow the deaths to continue. That makes us no better than he is .. probably less so in fact because he is insane and we know that.

> Name a country the US supports fully that that countries
> gov. uses chemical weapons on its civilians, takes over
> other nations, initiates in mass murders etc.

I can think of one that does all that to it's closest neighbour (bar the chemical bit), but lets not turn it into an argument about that country. That county by the way also knowingly sells weapons supplied by the US to Zimbabwe to use on their own people.

> That is his problem, the he needs to adjust to the
> world, not the world to his "Im the king of the castle"
> attitude.

We should have to adjust to ANY king of the castle attitude.

> No one takes the UN seriously, the UN is a powerless
> organization right now that cant do squat if the US
> attacks Iraq.

I do not believe that you are an expert on the UN, this is your opinion only and only lacks credibility because of the countries with the power of veto who believe they have more right to make decisions in the world than other countries. If they were more prepared to listen to their less powerful cousins the world would be a lot nice to live in right now.

> I dont give a rats ass what Mr. Kofi says, his ideas are
> about as good as Jesse Jacksons.

But if you don't give a rats arse about what others think, why then would you expect others to give a rats arse about what you think? We should care about what others think even if we dont' agree.

> Lets face the facts, the UN is just a puppet
> organization for the strong Security Council countries
> and the poorer nations pleading for aid money.

*sigh* .. pity so many people have your attitude, it does defeat the purpose of the United Nations.

> We dont live in a perfect world, there is no such thing
> as everyone in country A loves everyone in country B.

agreed.

> The US has done far more positive for the world than
> negative, I can state that with pride and honor.

I also agree. However, that doesn't mean we should become complacent about the negative does it? Surely there is room for improvement in any country?

> Oh dear. Every country on this planet tries to protect
> its home based industry...

Actually very few do to the level that the US does.

> "World Court thingie" ? The world court is filled with a
> bunch of liberals who wont even let us execute
> terrorists...

The same one that the US is whining at about the Airbus subsidies .. good enough to use when it suits them, but ignore it when things don't go their own way.

You can't have it all ways. You can't run policy that protects your people but badly disadvantages other countries whilst keeping the friendship and respect of the other countries. How can you even suggest that? Do you think a family that loses everything in Australia because of the US dumping wheat out into the world market at $1 a tonne is going to thank the US for looking after it's own people?

Indeed, by going a step further .. if you don't like feeding the world, why are you taking steps to destroy the economy in other countries so they can't feed themselves?

These acts are deliberate on the part of the US Government, they're fully aware of the effects they have on other countries but they choose to ignore them. If your farmers cannot run their farms at a profit then they should go bankrupt and have someone who can run it that way take over. It's how it works in other countries. Our country doesn't prop up dead businesses and continue to pour money into something that isn't viable, it's a hard decision but a good one.

> Good joke, no seriously that was a good laugh.

You laugh at the facts?

> Oh so now you want us in East Timor???

Again I never said that. My statement was nothing more than proof that the US is not called in every time and is not expected to go in every time. The US wasn't needed in East Timor, success was achieved without US involvment.

> LOL I thought you just said we should stay at home?

In that instance the US wasn't needed, you totally missed the point.

> All Chris said was that we do the bulk of the logistical
> and support. We do COME IN to alot of places first.

No he inferred ALL. YOu are right, the US involvement is always there, and i'm sure almost always appreciated. But when you talk in terms of the US only you insult all the other nations that are doing what they can to assist the country as well. That's my point.

> So now we are communists?

I don't think you are, but the attitudes from time to time seem eerily familiar.

> We dont have to give aid if we dont want to.

Never suggested you did, but the haves have a moral obligation to assist the have nots. That's the *christian* way isn't it?

> Its a choice of free will. What because the US is a rich
> nation it has to give away free money? I dont think so.

Never said it had to, it should because it's the right thing to do.

> Starting from the fact that what many African and Asian
> countries are facing now goes back to the European
> Colonization age...so I guess the US has to pay for
> them...

Again, those with the money should help those who don't. American countries have and continue to benefit from the poor economies of these countries. Those shoes you pay $150 for? They cost about $1 to be made in one of those poor asian countries!

I've not suggested the US is the blame for any of the woes in Asia or Africa, all of us (the west) hold a certain responsibility for assisting where and when we can. We should assist countries like Zimbabwe BEFORE they become like Afghanistan, before the inevitable famine comes and the people start starving to death in their hundreds of thousands.

> Sorry but on other sites...*coughs* I only see US
> bashing and few people who actually have good things to
> say.

Actually on other sites .. *coughs* you see bashing of many countries. The nice things ARE said when the right threads start. I love America, I think it's a fantastic country to visit but I wouldnt' want to live there, but I really despise some of the foreign policies and I absolutely despise the "we're better than you" attitude some have. Apparently that makes me anti-american, I am happy to live with that title if that's what it means and will continue to have my say about what I see as appalling foreign policy decisions that are made from time to time.

I also have a huge problem with some of the human rights atrocities that go on in America, but then I have the same problem with them when they occur here (such as deaths in custody), and will also have a say about that.

> Sick about victims of the US?? Ok Bron, how have you
> been personally hurt by the US?

Actually yes, illegal trade subsidies do not have a small affect on our economy you know. Watching family lose the farms that have been in our possession since settling them in the early 1800's hurts like hell and knowing it's because we can't compete with the cheap food being dumped onto the world market by the US does hurt like hell.

> Fine ok, let me come over to your house and count how
> many US products you use, that were invented by or
> supported by the US...what did the US do? Burn down your
> house?

Feel free, i'm not so wrapped up in anti american hatred that i'll not buy anything from them although I can't see anything in this room that was manufactured in the US. I buy Australian where ever possible, not because any anti-american feeling but for the same reason that you should buy American, to support my economy.

I don't buy Vegimite anymore, but not because it's owned by a big American conglomerate, but because it's owned by a big American *tabacco* conglomerate and I avoid any support of tabacco companies regardless of where they are from.

> Waging war?????? BWHAHAHHA We had a civil war, Im proud
> of the fact that the Union won the war. Not many
> countries can claim that fact?

I can't say i'd want to claim that fact. Funny isn't it how different attitudes are on that, you are proud your country fought and won a war. I'm proud my country didn't have to.

> Bron: why dont you just ask Russia, England, France and
> late Germany...they can tell you a thing or two about
> civil wars...Oh sure...not many countries had them...I
> think you made that up as you were going along..

I know for a fact that my country and our nearest neighbour have autonomy without the need to fight for it, thus proving that it's possible to do so. We remain in the commonwealth only because we choose to do so, we were given freedom that we didn't need to fight for. Not a single drop of blood was spilled for that. I'm damn proud of that.

> What is the point of supporting other countries that
> dont support us????????????

Moral obligation, Christian beliefs ? Because it's the right thing to do?

> Bron do you know what the definition of communism is?

Yes.

> No one ever achieved communism, the Soviet Union was at
> best far socialist. Please dont talk about things you
> have no idea about. The US is a Republic. In big and fat
> letters.

I'm aware of that, I use the term "communist" to refer to the communist block countries which is a term they called themselves.

VH-ADG

[mirrodie]

can't say I'm happy with the way you make me look an idiot but not to worry I get that all the time No offense HKGspotter, but no one can mae you look like an idiot. Ever wonder why you "get that all the time?"

I didnt even read Brons whole post, I fell asleep after the first two lines. Damn straight, so did I. Hate to say it Chris but YOUR site IS wonderful BUT it SEEMS that a few USERS are making this site resemble airliners.net.

Stick to planes, people images/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[hkgspotter1]

So when do you think the first A380 will be rolled out ??, I guess it will be in 2004.

[Robert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hkgspotter1:
Chris,

I know that 90% of Americans do not support Bush on the whole but they do on the Iraqi issue.

As for your reply to me I can't say I'm happy with the way you make me look an idiot but not to worry I get that all the time images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

I think the point you and many others miss is this, every day your pumped full of news on how evil these countries are and how the USA/UK is in danger. Living in Asia I get a much more even supply of news, just as I think VH-ADG does down in OZ. I do not support Iraqi but I do not and will not support another attack on Iraqi. The UN are in Iraqi NOW. If there is something evil they will find it, they are not being blocked in any way from their duty so I can't see how the USA/UK can keep saying they have weapons of mass distruction.

Is Sudam a evil man ??, YES, we all know what he's done in the past but hurting a whole country to get at one man will not help.

If the USA could look into the future sometimes and see what a mess they make for other countries in the region of their wars. You will note the war's the US fights are almost never anywhere near home. (Pacific, Vietnam, Iraqi, Afghanistan)

Please try to see views that are not from the USA/UK, this is the biggest problem with this issue.

Look I have no interest to make any anti American posts on your site Chris, you have a great site that you should be very happy with but please do not make the mistake Johan did and block anything thats not with your own thinking.

Now why can't people spend more time looking at Pakistan and India, these are two countries that have the bomb (Confirmed) and could cause a major problem for millions of people images/smiles/icon_confused.gif

Please note I'm not attacking the USA, I've been to the states twice and the people are great. As for your country, I've near seen such amazing places like Yosemite, death Valley, Vegas and Phoenix.

Kind Regards & a Merry Christmas to all.
Daryl<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I don't think that Chris tried to make you look like an idiot. He was just pointing out the facts and trying to clear something up.. And while we're on the subject of clearing things up..


90% of Americans DO NOT support an attack on IRAQ!

You don't seem to understand, we are NOT going to wait until he attacks us which he will surely try. We are going after him FIRST!

Would I put my life on the line for the protection of the US?
Yes.
My brother who is in the USMC will be going to Iraq if/when this war happens. If I was currently in the armed forces, I too would go.
Honestly tell me and I've asked you this before..
If we would have attacked Afghanistan pre 9-11-01 because of intelligence that the Taliban was planning an attack on us, how would you feel?

You would probably be saying the same things now, right?
AND if you could tell Bush not to attack Iraq because you feel he is not planning anything against us, and he listened but a few months later an attack does happen and it kills 10,000 people. How would you feel?
We are truly damned if we do and damned if we don't!
We cant seem to please you. I'm sorry we will pull out of Afghanistan, and Iraq and sit back while terrorist's blow the hell out of our country, because you don't think we should attack them and disarm them first.

[Robert]

Oh and Johan has probably made a mistake but only allowing one sided views, but hey your not banned!

Say if you lived in Canada and I said "Canada sucks, they have no backbone all they do is sit around while 97% of their people don't want them to help out the US."

(Which is an untrue statement)
Would you allow me to say that without yourself saying something back to it?
I doubt it. When people state so called facts and have their visions blurred about this whole Iraq thing, someone is bound to put their two cents in. That does not mean they are not open for discussion or other peoples views.
You may not think we should attack Iraq, bu for me having lived here and through 9-11 I wouldnt take anymore chances.

[Robert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mirrodie:
can't say I'm happy with the way you make me look an idiot but not to worry I get that all the time No offense HKGspotter, but no one can mae you look like an idiot. Ever wonder why you "get that all the time?"

I didnt even read Brons whole post, I fell asleep after the first two lines. Damn straight, so did I. Hate to say it Chris but YOUR site IS wonderful BUT it SEEMS that a few USERS are making this site resemble airliners.net.

Stick to planes, people images/smiles/icon_wink.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

In a way, yes. But at least Chris is open to both sides.

smilewink.gif

Long live the 752! images/smiles/icon_wink.gif images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif clap.gif

[hkgspotter1]

OK, the fact is we don't agree and we can't agree on this matter so I'm not saying another word on the subject

.......when they drop the first bomb I'll start again images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[FinalApproach]

ORIGINALLY POSTED BY ME Before a few novels were written!!!!!!: Groundcrew1
Full Member
Member # 140

posted December 18, 2002 02:00 PM

"I agree Robert, but this is a free speech forum! I don't want to see a civil war. So I say end the country nonsense. I personally believe there should be no borders and we(the world) should all work as one!"


I guess nobody reads my posts!!!! images/smiles/icon_sad.gif images/smiles/icon_sad.gif images/smiles/icon_sad.gif So good, I can say what EVER I WANT HEHHEHHEHHEHHEH images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Robert]

Where has Gary been? He made this topic and hasnt posted in it since.. Hmm...

images/smiles/icon_wink.gif J/K.

To your post:
Maybe the world should work as one, but I know that isnt going to happen anytime soon. People say "Send candy instead of bombs."
haha what the hell would that do? Fatten up the terrorist before they crash planes into our building??


laff.gif

[FinalApproach]

Robert, All though I am A.NET PE #2 I didn't start this topic
PROOF BELOW

: Jetphotos.net VS Airliners.net
Pages: 1 2 Topic started by: jmc_757-200
Replies: 30 - Views: 385

Secondly my previous post, I was wanting you to understand the part about "no civil war" or the country battles!!!

[Thomas_Cook_757-200]

Hi, your replies are quite interesting but I would just like to clarify that I do think airliners.net is an excelant website which can provide you with a lot of useful information, it just needs modernisation and freshening up! This does not effect my opinion of JetPhotos.net at all but I just wanted to make that clear. nod.gif

Thanks

jmc_757-200 heart.gif JMC

[Robert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Groundcrew1:
Robert, All though I am A.NET PE #2 I didn't start this topic
PROOF BELOW

: Jetphotos.net VS Airliners.net
Pages: 1 2 Topic started by: jmc_757-200
Replies: 30 - Views: 385

Secondly my previous post, I was wanting you to understand the part about "no civil war" or the country battles!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Somebodys all worked up..


images/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[mirrodie]

If it happens in 2004, that would be pretty awesome.

BTW, is it against the rules to call someone a douchebag? (not that I was planning to.) images/smiles/icon_cool.gif

[shamrock145hvy]

Lets stop worrying about politics, and do some forum with JetPhotos.com. We are not politicians. Lets talk aviation, thats why we are in this forum! Comments, I'm sure?

laff.gif laff.gif laff.gif laff.gif laff.gif laff.gif

shamrock145hvy

[Boeing4ever]

Well, I have to say that Jetphoto.net is a welcome relief from the anti-american drudgery of A.net!

[NWA_Flyer757]

Right on. I am so sick of A.net it isn't even funny. JP.net is an awesome site, with tons of great people, and potential to grow. And in my opinion A.net can go to hell. All they go is cause problems. Okay I am biased, but just because America is the best country in the world doesn't mean we are the meanest. We have helped many countries in need. We deserve the respect we so greatlt earned. In our short years we've achieved many leaps and bounds. Don't run a country down because they want to protect the sakc of there citizens. We were attack, we are going to take action. I'm my opinion, that "country" iraq (will nevr spell out with a capital leeter) should be blown to hell. Just wanted to say that. And I'm not going to get into any more politics, I just wanted to say my part.

Cory Klimko
Proud AMERICAN
Proud REPUBLICAN

[Chris Kilroy]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NWA_Flyer757:
I'm my opinion, that "country" iraq (will nevr spell out with a capital leeter) should be blown to hell. Just wanted to say that. And I'm not going to get into any more politics, I just wanted to say my part.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Cory,

I'm not sure I agree with that!

There is no doubt in my mind that the vast majority of Iraqis (or people in any nation, for that matter) are good, peace-loving people who are interested in giving their families the best life possible, and living happily.

My problem lies with the leadership of certain countries (Iraq included). Iraq, like many nations, could be viable and prosperous if not for the dictatorial and inhumane governing policies of the leadership, which is one of the reasons for change.

Just my two cents.

[Avianca 757]

I couldn't agree more with Chris

[NWA_Flyer757]

Right, but I think that the problems that they, and ither countries have caused us, and vice versa has lead to me believing that the country as a whole is bad. What can I say, I was extremely upset about the 9/11, and to be frank with you, hated every single Middle Eastern country at the time. I guess it's just whats happening in the world. 0.02 cents.

[FMS]

Isn't it amazing how a simple "this website or another"-poll thread turns into the kind of political debate that can often be seen on the forum of a (not to be named) Aviation site.net..

The question was "A.net or JP.net", right?
Looks like the poll stated "Europe or USA"...

I'd say JP.net BTw
later

[Legend_Airlines]

Well it's not so hard to believe.
I never believed there was such american vs. european forum "competition", especially on a website that dedicates itself to aviation photography.

To some, JetPhotos.net is a "rogue" bunch of a.netters. IMO, the JetPhotos website is a bit too similar to the layout of a.net, but I am happy with all the other services that I can't say the same for a.net.

So, hence I am on the forums here and not a.net, the grand answer is...JetPhotos.net images/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[Richard]

Great site. I've placed it above A.net on my bookmarks.

A.net is good. They have tons of photos, but my vote goes to jp.net. A.net, paying to use the forums? Brilliant, that sure is helpful for us student plane enthusiasts who are not old enough to have a credit card who want to participate but can't. I love discussing airliners and here is the only place where I can do that with so many other plane enthusiasts. I like these forums. One can freely express their views for free.

Another plus that this site has that A.net hasn't got is an aircraft census. I'm glad that this site has chosen to take up that responsibility after the Bill Harms site stopped updating. I speak for many others when I say thanks a lot for your work and dedication, I really appreciate it.

Great work. I hope this excellent site remains in operation for many years to come.

[Greg]

Although a new member at jp.net I have been at a.net for quite a while(pointed there by an advertisement in Airways magazine) I have to say that picture wise a.net wins as jp.net doesn't quite have the bulk of pictures as a.net but jp.net's forums win as they as you can get to them w/o money. So everyone at jp.net keep up the good work images/smiles/icon_smile.gif

As to the U.S. vs. the world debate all I have to say is while Europe is becoming more liberal the U.S. is looking more conservative. This philosphies although connected aren't really compatible unless everyone has a common goal. I believe the European allies(aka France, Russia, Germany) are being stupid in their adament criticisms of the U.S. but the U.S. can't get full of war plans yet as popular support for the war isn't prevelant among most young people(I talk about the group of people I know) But they need proof, when the proof is shown I believe public support for a war will materialize(atleast in the U.S.)

[Katamarino]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Robert:
clap.gif Peter..

I didnt even read Brons whole post, I fell asleep after the first two lines.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Whereas Polish is infinitely more interesting images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif

[bfpires]

So much for the jetphotos versus airliners debate...

[Russia_forever]

Robert said: "YOU don't know the reasons why we are after Iraq, unless of course you get a daily breifing from the UN?"

I dont get daily briefing from UN but I can tell you the answer is OIL. Please do not tell me about 'violations of human rights' or 'potential to develop weapons of so-called mass destruction' because I have pretty much similar such a potential in my school lab if I get the right ingredients.

[gocaps16]

I still check out airliners.net once or twice a day to read the forums and I still like it. It's just the people who runs it and it is overcrowded is why airliners.net sucks.

[KROC]

Most know my tumultuous history on Airliners.net. This site is truly a breath of fresh air, because the people that dominate Airliners.net in how it is run are ruining the site, and turning it into a laughing stock. Oh, and from first hand experience, don't try and help out either, because god forbid you take caoncern for the users on the site. Its amazing how a certain few gang up on you like a pack of wild dogs. Chris, great site. I just wish I had been participating here sooner...I might not have as many grey hairs as I do now if I did.

[PolishAir42]

Mike I didnt know you were from Jamaica....AHHAHA

Kudos on what you said though, I agree with that.

[genka]

Is it just me who thinks that jetphotos page design is a blatant ripoff from a.net? Was the original design licensed or stolen?

[c72]

Hey Mike!!!

Great to see you here dude!!!!

Holla if ya hear me!!!!

[KROC]

Biiiiiiig Pimmmmmmmmmp. Like I said, I should have been here along time ago...at least active. Johan has bent me over for the last time. I'm not going to get hosed for trying to help people, and help his site. And thats the word.... IF YA SMELLALALALALALALALALALALA what the KROC is Cookin!

[N27015]

hkgspotter1, I would say at least 2005... laff.gif

[KROC]

LOT, I'm transforming into the White Rasta. It's a side effect of being around all the ganja 70% of the A.net crew is smoking. images/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[PolishAir42]

LMAO...Mike

BTW I got a funny email from Mr. Larry Jackson, he bought himself a 1977 Lincoln Town Car...the act of buying it was the funny part images/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[Katamarino]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by genka:
Is it just me who thinks that jetphotos page design is a blatant ripoff from a.net? Was the original design licensed or stolen?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is extremely similar images/smiles/icon_wink.gif but i have no doubt that it is completely on the level. Its a serious site after all! There'd be no point stealing code and being shut down.

[FinalApproach]

I think jetphotos.net has a much more user friendly and respectable environment! I feel it gives everyone a chance to have joy about their photography! And it seems like almost all of the members are respectable people! I hope this site prospers forever!!! GOOD LUCK JP!!! clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif

[bfpires]

Groundcrew1:

Could not possibly agree more!!

clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif clap.gif

[Greg]

I love JP.net and the staff is wonderful and kind heart.gif

<FONT COLOR="black" SIZE="1">[ January 30, 2003 08:41 PM: Message edited 1 time, lastly by Greg ]</font>

[Stephen Toernblom]

All I am going to say is that I don't care for Bush at all and don't agree with his actions or opinions. That is one reason why I won't watch the news. I hope we do not go to war.

Now back to the original topic at hand. I like jetphotos and planepictures better because it is more photographer oriented and there are not stupid little kids flaming photos about being fake or responding with stupid, smart ass comments. This site and planepictures are both more professional and I like the look of both of these sites as I feel that a.net has gotten a little old.

Stephen